News you won't see in controlled mainstream media.

I wonder if anyone has any ideas about what's happening to me, if it's normal, if I seem to be making good choices?

Brief story: I had no amalgams in my adult teeth until about three years ago, and then I got four all at once. Two months later I developed clinical depression quite suddenly, and have had it ever since. I tried all sorts of things to deal with it, none worked. For quite a while now I've been thinking it's an issue with my lifestyle, needing to go out to work this autumn when my daughter goes to school, get more of a life back for myself. But I also wondered whether the amalgam fillings and the depression could be connected, and decided to get them out.

I had them removed over a period of 2 weeks by a dentist who did not take precautions. It was either this, or leave the removal for a year or more, until we had some funds. I took a risk, not one that I would recommend, because I know for sure that the procedure added to my body's mercury burden, whether or not it was causing the depression.

During the removal process I had a constant upset stomach, brain fog, intensification of the depression, etc. I continued to take my supplements, including massive doses of vitamin C, and was able to take Algin on the last day of removal.

The intensity of the stomach problems eased after that. A couple of days after the last removal I started a supplement called Detoxica, which contains glutathione precursors. I've continued with the Algin. I also discovered an interesting product called Heavy Metal Detox. This is one available here in Europe, and a study was done with it and a variety of other chelators that sang its praises. Here is some info: http://mercuryexposure.org/index.php?article_id=648

It is a liquid containing chlorella growth factor, energised chlorella homaccord, and coriandrum sativum. Essentially these are preparations made from chlorella and cilantro (coriander), one of them homeopathic. You have 40 drops in a drink 3 times a day before food.

The people in the study reported no side effects apart from slight headache, but then they weren't necessarily at the point of being sick from heavy metal exposure.

While I've been taking it I've experienced the continued intensification of the depressive symptoms, fatigue (resulting in the strong need for at least a brief nap mid-afternoon), constant low-level headache, brain fog, loss of appetite, low level upset stomach. Physical symptoms don't really matter to me, but depressive ones can be hard to cope with. Especially after 3 years of them. However, in a way I suppose that makes it just par for the course, I've been here before, I know the drill and it doesn't scare me. It just makes day to day life, especially looking after a child, difficult at times.

I thought at first I was going through a healing crisis, but I think now it's just plain chelation. I took the HMD for 6 days and am having a rest today. Maybe I'll need several days' rest, I don't know. My mind does feel more clear, the headache isn't there, and neither is the jaw pain and tooth sensitivity I've been experiencing. I'm still pretty low and fatigued though. If mercury is a culprit there, then I suppose the only thing I can do is keep chelating to get rid of it.

I eat quite a lot of sulphurous foods too. Last night I made homemade bolognaise sauce with onions, garlic, and basil. I felt quite anxious afterward, but a bit of Algin seemed to help.

I know there's a lot of debate about the effects of cilantro. My hunch is that this HMD preparation works for me, I think I can probably put up with the symptoms long term if I know that I'm getting better. It's just all such a lot of guesswork, as I've said before. I think if I were really harming myself, I'd know.

I think I need to get things moving through my colon a bit faster BTW. No doctors are involved here so I can't nip over to the clinic for an irrigation. I already take magnesium, would take more but it's mega-expensive here. I thought I might try several teaspoons of ground flaxseed during the day, see if that helps.

I'd love to be able to sweat it out but unfortunately I am also dealing with some damage done to me by an antidepressant I discontinued last year. If I do more than a walk, or if I get hot, I get sick. I'm sure those things aren't going to sabotage my body's detox efforts though, just have to try to work around them.

Any thoughts? It is taking some faith that the HMD-induced crappy feeling will lead to feeling better in the long run. But I think (hope) that may be the case.

Linda.

Hi Linda. I really feel for you because you are just out to do the best for yourself and sometimes you dont know if you're doing good or making things worse in the process.

At least you are amalgam free. That is one thing. As for eliminating the storage of mercury, that is another. Very individual and I went through many different chelation/detoxes and mostly mobilised it wildly everywhere, got far worse, spent ages trying to recover and hope that I would come out of it better off at the end.

Well, admittedly my risks often did allow me to end up with a bit less mercury but at what cost? Alot of agony and long term aftereffects. Sometimes I could be close to suicide with chelating and my symptoms would just explode. Though I realise to get mercury out, sometimes one has to endure some of the pain because mercury is so toxic that it has to move to come out and in doing so it circulates, so our symptoms increase. It should not be done to where you are endangering yourself.

I know you would prefer to take the natural path of detox, and that is your choice. And for some that suits them very well. I think mostly that is the wise choice, but when it comes to chelating mercury itself? whether natural chelation or not, if it's done in a manner than mobilises it too much, rather than removes it, you could really have problems regardless.

I know a few on here are doing the cutler protocol and seem to be happy with it and going pretty well. I feel it's the best because of how it is done and how much study was done on it. but again you may wish to keep trying what you're doing. But yeah dont expect to feel all that great during detox regardless. and you could well be experiencing the usual worsening of symptoms during the elimination of heavy metals. It also can flare up or worsen yeast issues and people sometimes dont realise how much that comes into play with this illness and during detox and often they miss treating it and suffer far more than necessary. So yeast is essential to treat by diet and natural methods to help control symptoms and make life a bit easier.

If your body has trouble sweating, dont force it to do so. You will make yourself sick without actually helping anything. I stopped being able to sweat freely once I got very very sick and I tried to have hot baths like I used to so I could get toxins out of my skin and instead of that, I got so ill I nearly threw up. I was not eliminating a thing, rather I was stressing my system in forcing it to do something it couldn't do properly and actually doing the opposite of what I was trying to achieve. Because once I was able to eliminate mercury through the skin and handle hot baths and sweat, did not mean that it was right for me later on when I could not endure this method this time around. I had to give that up and listen to my body instead..

So I stopped doing that. I now stick to what I can handle and that is pretty much just general walking, treadmill or on the street. Nothing too strenuous, but enough to where I'm moving, getting my circulatin going and I know it's good for me. Rebounders are great, they exercise your whole system and lymph! So that combined with walking maybe wonderful for you, but again only what you can handle.

But more than that? And it can be too much for a body that is trying to concentrate on healing.

It really does depend on how far along you are and how much you can take. Taking epsom salt baths are great to aid eliminating toxins via the skin and you may sweat much easier without much effort. Or a combinating of sea salt and baking soda is excellent. If you can cope with hot baths and this, great. If you cannot cope with too hot a bath, again do not heat it too much. But the stuff in it will help regardless.

I wish there was a perfect protocol and smooth way of dealing with this toxicity but there isn't. It is usually a roller coaster ride for most people.

Hi Bex, and thanks. You repeat yourself here tirelessly don't you. I've been browsing through old posts and I've seen you mention similar things. I've just ordered some kind of clay detox bath mixture online, see what it does, but it's also useful to know about the epsom salts. Those shouldn't be hard to find.

Yes, listening to your body is vitally important isn't it. I read a thread here where someone did round after round of DMPS even though it was making them feel incredibly awful. Because . . . it must be good fer ya.

I did learn something interesting this morning. I took the Detoxica and just left the HMD out, but still got the cluster of symptoms I described (which includes a slight metallic taste in my mouth, I forgot to add), just to a somewhat lesser degree. It must mean that the Detoxica is working too. I'm going to cease that for the rest of the day and really try to give my body a break.

The thinking was that my body would go at its own rate because without the HMD, everything else I'm taking is natural to the body. It makes glutathione out of the Detoxica. I'm taking a range of other supplements. Diet is good. Maybe this is why it still seems to want to detox, and why I had such a strong initial reaction when the amalgams came out. I've been on a supplement regime, and the Paleolithic diet (with some problems with sugar here and there) for over a year, so maybe my system has been ready and waiting to start dumping.

I don't think candida overgrowth is a problem for me . . . I don't seem to have many of the symptoms for that. I'm lucky. With my sugar addiction you'd think it would love my gut. I still have cravings, which shouldn't happen because I am eating very little sugar now, not even fruit, but it seems to be part and parcel of the depression. I know that it would really mess up the mercury detox if I ate it so I think I'll be able to muster up the willpower I need.

How are you doing yourself Bex? You help a lot of people here. I wish we could help you more. It sounds like you are doing so many things right.

Hi linda, lol yes I repeat myself often. But I think if one finds methods that seem tried and tested and true, then yeah I think they good to pass on and so it does get recycled a lot.

Yeah clay baths can really help some people. Especially if you are eliminating enough via your pores. Epsom salts are good too because you'll get the magnesium from that as well as the other benefits.

wow, the stuff you are taking must be doing something for sure! Metal taste seems pretty indicative to me. That's one thing that used to happen to me when I was detoxing mercury and sometimes it got so bad the metal taste would make me almost sick. that coupled with smelling of metal. If I exercised, people would smell metal on me from my sweat.

Sometimes you can do too many detoxes at once and it can get a bit much. Also sometimes the symptoms dont hit until a while later, so you may increase the dose too soon or take too many detoxing agents at once.

Like you, you know when you're getting hit by it and it is really unpleasant at the time. You can be disheartened and certain that you're not really detoxing at all, but just getting worse or getting nowhere. Later on you may have a patch where you notice a clearing and you feel motivated again. But then the detox comes back and you go right down again. It is very much an erratic ride.

It's good that you may not have much of a candida issue. yours may simply be mercury and you maybe suffering symptoms from that alone. You kind of know in yourself anyway. The candida diet should produce some results or die off within weeks of doing it. Something at least should occur if that is part of the problem.

I'm still having problems thanks for asking. But am working on getting my composites replaced soon with cerec porcelain. Im definitely struggling on the diet right now and trying to avoid cheating, but stuffed up when I ate potatoes. Amazing how it becomes that ridiculous!!! But that's the way it is for me right now.

People have been very helpful really. But I think that I suffer with some rather mysterious problems that dont tend to respond to what used to help me! So it's difficult to know what to suggest. I cannot even really help myself much, so the diet is all I have to work with.

hello veggiejuicer: I know what you are going through I struggled with it for many years now I have about 4 boxes of different suppliments or natural remmedies that I have tried over the years some helped for a few days but most did not,for me the depression was the worst for me ,the other symtoms were bad enough but the depression was the crippler ,I had my amalgams removed 2 monthes ago and feeling much better ,I started to use cilantrro and chlorella and other natural chelators and had very bad detox symtoms and found that my body would only detox at its own speed ,if I tried to speed up the process there would be a heavy price to pay ,what helped me was staying away or limiting sulfer foods ,eating alot of turkey and chicken for protein ,a good multi vitamin,flax oil seed capsules for omega 3,algin to mop up mercury in the blood stream,and baciclly just let your body detox at it's own speed after starting this regiment I started to feel much better within a few days (hope this help out)

Heavymetalme, it sounds like your path has been similar to mine. Amalgam removal was my last course of action for the depression. I'm still not sure how connected it is with mercury. It's possible that the depression will lift when I get a job. (Looking for a part time one in teaching, not easy to find, and summer holidays are coming up.) But I suppose it would be nice to find that the mercury really is at the bottom of it.

I am a determined person and everything else I've tried, I've really applied myself to, but it didn't work. I sometimes wonder if it was meant to be this way, that I've been guided to this "last resort." If the other things I tried had worked, I wouldn't have had my amalgams out. Well . . . time will tell.

I think my supplement regime is good, and like I said that's probably why my body seems ready to detox. I take a living multivitamin from Garden of Life that has lots of B-vits, colloidal minerals, fish oil, vitamin C, calcium and magnesium citrate, zinc, and chromium. Recently added vitamin E and selenium. It was supposed to help with the depression LOL, and the recovery from the antidepressant. I think the mercury in my body has slowed that recovery process. I'm glad to be getting rid of it now.

I think some people come here thinking mercury is their one and only problem, and it isn't always. They perhaps need to do some further searching. I feel lucky because I've been down that road myself and I think I've eliminated just about everything else that could be plaguing me, apart from lifestyle as I said. I'm really glad I've got the diet and supplements sorted because they've put me in a good position to do a detox. It sounds like you are using similar detox agents to me, so let's both keep fingers crossed <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />

Bex, thanks for the detox details. I didn't know what to expect when I started, but a week of deep depression has been unpleasant. Still, I think there's enough reason now to hope that it's the get-worse-before-you-get-better scenario.

What is your diet like, then? What drove you to those potatoes? You said you were on varius drugs in the past; it could be a possibility that you are experiencing lingering effects of that too. I belong to another forum just as full of pain and suffering as this one, but it was caused by psychotropic drugs. For all the supposed wonders of modern medicine and science, those in whom we place our trust have the power to really devastate lives.

You resist those potatoes and I'll resist the chocolate, deal?

Hey cool, I just gave you some stars <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" /> I still haven't figured out completely how that works.

I tried the "heavy metal detox" and experienced the same thing. Things got worse, but it wasn't a healing crisis, I was just actually making things worse.

I think anyone who is serious about this should attempt the cutler protocol and supplementation. Now when I'm chelating, I'm feeling better instead of worse. I mean, detoxing is hard on the body yes, but overall you should be doing your body good. If your not seeing that happen over a period of several months, stop and try something else as it is not working.

Hi Linda, my cravings for foods I shouldn't eat are probably indicative of the yeast issues. Potatoes were my idea of attempting to allow myself something that I thought "wasn't that bad". Well, I knew better and the effects from them are evident enough. They feed candida probably as well as direct sugar in my opinion.

I had antidepressants in the past but not for years or anything like that. Just a time in my life around age 20 -21, but I never stayed on them becuase they gave me side effects. I went on teh candida diet for the first time by age 22 and was far happier.

But back then I had mercury toxicity and did not have all the issues I now have, so I was able to improve. Now, I tend to struggle continually going from one day to another.

But it's deal, no potatoes for me and no chocolate for you <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/wink.gif" alt="" /> lol. Hard to stick to though, but I have to do this.

Re you getting worse with the stuff you're taking? Like claythrow said, sometimes it isn't a good thing and if the effects continue for too long, it may not be a suitable protocol for you and if you dont seem yourself improving, then I'd not stay on it for too long. Andy's is definitely one I recommend to people, because it's so much more stable and effective.

in regards to my diet? I usually typically eat eggs, meat, chicken, liver, vegetables (no potatoes, beans or corn due to being too high in carbs), acidophilus yoghurt, raw nuts sometimes (almonds/brazil) and plenty of the good fats like butter, olive oil, coconut oil, fish oil, lard etc.

That's the basic diet for me. If I venture off that I really get into even worse trouble. My own fault of course, but it's tough. I had antibiotics last year and really did myself in badly. I now have even more struggles than ever since and my gums receded after it. So I'd warn anybody to try and steer clear of ever taking them if you can. It was a bad move I ever did. But I had a bad infection from a flu that was not improving and eventually I didnt' know what other choice I had. It was the first time I've taken antibiotics for a flu. Yet, I bleive if I had stuck to my diet and not cheated, I may have healed from that. But I did not do that, i cheated and the infection would flare and get even worse. So part of that was my own fault.

I liked the picture of you and your girl, gave things context...

LOL . . . can't win here. I was told in a not very friendly way that the world probably doesn't want to see my child. And really, I've been no one but "mummy" for four and a half years now. It would be nice to be "me" again too.

You know, it's hard to get an objective idea of what's happening with me because the original problems are still so acute. So I can't really say that my detox substances are making me worse. I had my "day off" yesterday and while the headache, metallic taste and extreme fatigue were gone, the depression, brain fog and anxiety were as bad as ever. I think they got worse when I had my amalgams out but even there I can't be too sure. Since last December when I was given a box of chocolates as a present, I've been on/off sugar like a real hardened addict, until several weeks ago when I really made myself stop so I could detox properly.

I'm aware of all the devastating effects sugar can have on health, but I'm sad to say I couldn't find any other way to cope with what the depression was doing to me. The sugar boosted some feel-good chemicals in me and made me feel not so low. Less irritable. It was a very high price to pay and I'd like to say I was strong enough to just weather it, but it gets so hard. When you have a little girl to look after, you want to be motivated to play with her, go out with her, have patience with her.

Right now I am an irritable [censored], and a zombie too. I'd have my face in a bowl of chocolate pudding or a pile of brownies if it weren't for the determination to detox properly.

Is it the mercury? Is it the depression? Hard to say. But I'm going to stick to my detox protocol for now and see how I go, I think it may work for me. I do intend to try ALA at 3-hour intervals in a few months. Right now I'm on my own with the detox, very little money to spare, couldn't afford DMSA ect if I wanted to. But I am also very, very wary of drugs and want to stay away from them wherever possible. So yes Bex, I totally get what you're saying about antibiotics. Not good to ravage your gut flora unless it's absolutely necessary.

Thanks for the chat guys, things are pretty rough right now.

About the diet Bex . . . nice work. Sounds absolutely brilliant.

I know you said you've tried loads of different supplements. And I'm not exactly an expert. But on the drugs list where I've been for over a year, nutritional protocols are the way people heal, so I've picked up a little knowledge there. If you'd like to tell me what supplements you are taking now, maybe I could help. Just a thoght. I'd like to do anything I can. You've been through so much, done so many things right, and it's about time for you to see the light at the end of the tunnel I think.

LOL, yeah Linda you can't win!!! If it's any consolation I like both pics!!!!

Well, my diet is good if only I would stick to it for long enough to yield results and then once I got to that point, to actually "sustain" it and not go off and eat something and sabbotage it all. I have a real addiction problem with sugar, so I relate completely to what you are saying.
candida diet was the only relief I got with symptoms aside from mercury chelation. So only you will be able to tell what helps. Also, you have to be on this diet for weeks before you'll know whether it's really going to help, or whether there is more to it and on top of that you can get worse before you get better. But the problem is obviously mercury which unfortunately allows yeast to overgrow, so we struggle wtih that plus the cravings and then the feelings of being deprived at the sametime when we try and stick to this diet as well as suffering symptoms. So it can indeed increase the feelings of depression and deprivation. My hope is that if I hang on long enough, maybe I'll get some improvement.....

The diet should help, but sometimes if the other toxicity is bad enough you may not notice much benefits from diet until that toxicity has been eliminated. So hard to know what is doing what and how to deal with it.

Well, my supplements are mainly the following (when I take them). Halibut oil (for vitamin A and some D), B complex, vitamin C (lab quality powder one), vitamin E, magnesium, calcium, milk thistle and omega 3 fish oil and sometimes selenium and I am about to get some zinc. Apparently that is a pretty important one to get. Main thing is replacing the antioxidants because mercury or other toxicity uses them up big time.

And of course the good fats with that. To be quite honest with you, I dont notice supplements do much for me unless I have been on the diet long enough to be able to even absorb them so they can actually do something for me.
Just today I have been very strict and not eaten any potatoes or grains and still feel horrible and grotty and depressed. I can only hope for some lifting in a few days. I dont know about any light at the end of the tunnel (i wish), I used to get told that a lot, but if there is? It's the longest tunnel I've ever seen.

Thanks a lot though for you ongoing care and kind/helpful comments. These forums make me feel like I am actually in touch with like-minded and like-suffering people. Because otherwise I feel like I'm in a twilight zone. Some freak among the normal (healthy), but on here I realise and reminded that I am not alone.

But yeah Linda, it is so hard that one does so much to try and help themselves and when you get little or no response, it is very heavy going to continue making such efforts. I hope that you will start to feel relief from this yourself. I can only admire a person who has this PLUS has to manage a family and attempt somehow to behave remotely normal. To me that is something.

I wish you could get DMSA, but yes the cost is pretty unbelieveable and for people who can ill afford it, it's just not even an option. ALA when you can begin to use it, hopefully will start to clear this out of your organs and stop the process of it building up in your blood/tissues again.

At the moment it is possible that you are flooded with mercury and just not seeing any light at all. It's not just mercury's direct effects, it is also the fact it weakens and allows other problems to develop as well. So you can end up with a multifactoral problem. One thing tends to offset another. LIke mercury can cause yeast, yeast can methylate mercury and make it more toxic, both poison the system, gut and liver and on the cycle goes.

Have you tried algin by the way? sorry if youve already mentioned this, but it may help some of your symptoms. Russ recommends a basic formula to take algin, selenium and vitamin E and vitamin C (I think).

Hi Bex,

When my little girl isn't around I miss her. I have to get out of bed in the morning because of her. And taking care of her means I can't sit on the sofa feeling sorry for myself all day. So that's good in a way. But at the moment I feel like I am failing her and my husband both. I've got my husband to understand to a degree what is happening with me, that it isn't his fault, and he's waiting patiently. But not forever. The icing on the cake, really, has been the ongoing sexual dysfunction from the drug I was on, which did not go away even when I discontinued it. I try not to think too much about it, there are other things to be concerned about at the moment.

Like you say, there can be so many pieces to the puzzle. Mercury can be just a part. The clinical depression has an element of SAD (seasonal affective disorder) and I'd forgotten about that. The past several weeks we've hardly had any sun here, it's been cloudy with loads of rain. The floods they had 40 miles north of here were international news. The sun actually came out this morning and as I walked in it I felt substantially relieved. About half an hour ago the rain clouds came back and as I was finishing mowing the lawn a wheel popped off the mower, looks pretty irreparable. LOLOL happens.

Right, so about diet and supplements . . . it sounds like you're more or less trying to do the Paleo diet, I think the candida diet is fairly similar. And if you've got issues with sugar like me, then staying away from grains and potatoes really is important. I've had quite a lot of success eating this way in the past, but the depression deepened last winter as it always does and has stayed pretty deep since then. Part of me still thinks sugar is "the drug" to help, but if it really were, I wouldn't continually be trying to stay away from it. One of the worst immediate effects it has is depressing your immune system by making your white blood cells really sluggish.

I know you eat healthy fats; do you have enough? Sometimes we can mistake a sugar craving for something else the body needs. Maybe it's more fat, or protein. I've been told to try swigging some olive oil when I crave sugar and occasionally it has helped.

Sounds like you've got some good vitamin C there. How much do you take? Also, how much cal and mag, and what types?

I don't know much about halibut oil. How much do you have, and what quantities of DHA and EPA does it contain? A couple of good, pure fish oils I've seen recommended are Carlson's, and Eskimo-3. I'm not sure if you have these in New Zealand. I had Eskimo-3 for a while here in the UK, then started getting my parents in the US to ship me Carlson's because it's better and cheaper.

Have you ever taken a colloidal mineral supplement? That can be pretty important in a healing regime.

Actually, to sum it all up, the crux of the protocol on my other list consists of the following: a high quality multivitamin (I get my B-vits from that as well as other things), colloidal mineral supplement, fish oil, and calcium and magnesium. Most people take other things too depending on what their needs are.

I know I keep saying that our funds are low. They weren't so low until I started the diet and supplement stuff. It costs, I know it. And it hurt, it meant we've been scraping for money ever since, and it's taking ages for me to get a job. But you can't put a price on your health can you, as long as what you're looking at is within the realm of the possible. And I give some supplements to my daughter too, because I care about her health. We could of course go back to how we were, and save a lot of money, but I firmly believe we are doing the right thing and looking after ourselves.

Of course, I thought that these things alone would make me well. And for many people, they do. The Paleo diet, plus supplements, can get people diagnosed with bipolar disorder, schizophrenia, depression etc off their drugs, and keep them well. They can cure many other conditions, including cancer and MS.

As you say, though, if you have a toxicity problem, that has to be addressed. And depression can have a huge spectrum of causes. If it's due to something in your life needing to be changed, then you're probably not going to make much progress until you change it.

Do you know if there are any naturopathic doctors in your area? That is where I'd look for help. I know there's a clinic in London I could go to, run by a doctor who studied with Abram Hoffer, and they could do tests for me if need be. I hope that won't be necessary, but if it is you bet I won't be going to my GP, who gave me antidepressants and told me he didn't think amalgam fillings contained mercury anymore.

Guess this is enough for now . . . better go see if I can find the energy to juice some veg. Funny how I use that as my monicker, but I don't have much enthusiasm for it nowadays.

Linda.

Sorry Bex, I didn't see your last question. I've been taking Algin for about a week an a half now, usually 6 capsules a day. I'm also taking vitamin C, and recently started on the vitamin E and selenium.

I noticed from some past posts that you were talking about possible cavitations. Have you had x-rays for these? I've also read that if the dentist or doctor injects an antibacterial agent into the area and the symptoms stop, it can be a good indication. Do you think this is the problem? Do you get any facial pain or neuralgia?

Just brainstorming here, I'll say again I'm not an expert and I don't expect to be seen as one. Just want to try to help <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />

i thought this post would fit well in chelation experience so far.

i would say my IQ in the last 7 months has gone from 180 to.. possibly 50 or lower, i was a genius and honestly prided myself too much on intelligence, but there are worse things right...?. i sleep around 14 hours straight every day, everything is a blur, although one thing has improved, i think my coordination is better i can now eat a meal with a knife and fork without multiple sclerosis type movement disorder.there was nothing wrong with me before i got these things out safely. i think the whole deal is too complicated, 50 million different ways to chelate, one makes someone sick the other makes them better, one wrong move and your in trouble, i think its very scary.

i rarely speak to anyone, i would have talked to people i knew in the day before all this started more than this entire 7 month period.

something is seriously wrong with my mind, although except for not talking, i look quite normal, the only thing someone would notice after a while is instead of not speaking much, i only speak when prompted, and then only very briefly. "yes, no, whatever" i spend most of my time if i am around anyone in using simple words to say i cannot speak.

my view of earth and humans in general, is very poor. if i ever recover, i think i would rather join a monk monastary (however u spell that) where u choose not to speak but are able, noone i've known has stuck by me in hard times, and they were all quite empathic people, although i do not feel (funny to say that isn't it) as empathic as me.

i am mostly past the suicidal part to the just waiting in hell part. i just wait for each day to pass, and take as little drugs from the docs as i can, to bear the pain, and when i sleep, or get so tired i have to, i am happy.

right now just to post this i've taken valium, heaps of pain killers, melatonin, smoked about 20 cigarettes, mostly just trying to slowwww down and get to read some stuff here and write.

i used to write in asseembly, and c++ and could spend hours coding programs, although going into comparisons is useless, simply drinking or eating anything for the day is a huge challenge,

if i had my time again i would say, PULL all my teeth out and i don't even care if u give me false teeth although that would be nice, just don't drill the stupid things.

I'd stay out of hell, benza, since it's probably chock full of dentists trained to torment you for eternity.

The only thing that really helped me when I was real sick was the IV chelation. And the only thing thing that keeps me going strong whilst I pay back bills and reload my devastated bank account from my illness over the winter is cilantro, garlic and chlorella (which did not do much for me prior to IV chelation, though loads of ascorbic acid Vitaminc C helped quite a bit, about 2000-3000+ mgs per day staggered throughout), which I know many here oppose (cilantro) but it does defintely work for me. I also keep a DMSA formula on hand and take that (about 50 mgs) 3-4 times per week at most (has ALA in it), in the evening or early morning on an empty stomach.

My brain fog/depression started to break after about 6-7 weeks of IV chelation, the IV EDTA in combo w/DMPS was significant there, and I had a major breakthrough after taking some oral ALA (just a little about 60 mgs) with the DMPS one day.. my current use of cilantro was a bit difficult to get onto an even keel with. I started with just a little bit when taking the oral DMSA in the evenings, I went full hog (eating LOTS)with it about 4-5 weeks ago only and have enjoyed a clarity of mind that I have not experienced since I can truly remember. I do remember lots of brain foggy days throughout the years, though of course I didn't make a connection to my amalgam fillings. Hopefully it will not return, I intend to always keep cilantro on hand now.

Sunshine is real important I think, and so is working outside to break a sweat. take a good few showers on those days to continually wash off with hot soapy water. Mowing may not be the best thing for you since it kicks up quite a bit of dust, pollen and eebie geebie organisms.

I have found integrative med doctors to be the best in this category. Naturopaths may offer great advice and novel ideas but probably won't be able to help you in a timely manner and you will end up suffering more as a result. My doctor is certified for heavy metal chelation by this group:

http://abcmt.org/

They may know of someone in your area who can help. A good doctor may work with you on paying for services, the IV chelation is not all that expensive or difficult for them, it most certainly saved my life and is worth every penny I spent there. I have also found that the category of integrative med dr's who do this type of work seem to sincerely care, they know they can definitely help, and they will do whatever they can to help you. They use a holistic approach but they are fully trained medical doctors also. It's worth a call or email even if funds are low. I am 100% certain that if I tried to approach this from only a holistic/naturopath or traditional med direction that I would either be dead or still in very very bad shape.

Cod liver oil is also great for keeping your brain protected and feeling well, make sure it is tested mercury free. Colonics are also extremely effective and very affordable, you need to clear your gut/colon so that mercury and other toxins do not redistribute from there.

Hi Benza,

I'm sorry you're feeling so poorly. I know how hard it can be. I've got some questions for you if you don't mind:

What have you done so far to chelate?

Did you go on any drugs at the same time, i.e. is that about when you started the Valium? It can cause the sorts of effects you describe.

What other drugs are you taking?

What is your diet like? Do you take any supplements?

What did you have the amalgams replaced with?

What prompted you to get the amalgams out -- were you having any symptoms beforehand?

Hope this helps. Brainstorming doesn't hurt and sometimes good ideas come up.

Kindest regards,
Linda.

The anxiety's been bad tonight. Can't see why. And yes it's clouded over again, but I got a good amount of time sitting in the sun today.

I can't imagine carrying on like this. I'm as bad as I get in the middle of the winter, don't want to be around people, don't want to be touched, can't concentrate, can't enjoy anything. I'm not sure why this is, but if it's mercury then I have decided to capitulate. Dawn provided a source for 25mg DMSA in the UK in an old post, so I've ordered some from there. It should last a little while at least if I'm doing 3 days on/3 days off, should at least give me an idea of whether it will work for me and how effective it will be. I will stop the HMD during that time.

I've been burned with drugs, I hate them. But people seem to do well with DMSA here so I think it's worth a go.

Hi Linda, hopefully the DMSA will help you. It can sometimes suppress symptoms as its removing the mercury, so you may find it even makes you feel a bit better. but again it may not and you may get an aggravation as the toxins are removed.

It goes either way. Ive had both. Some notice improvements quite quickly with it for some reason, but the main thing is to get the mercury out in a manner that actually starts helping you feel better, rather than mobilising it everywhere and then leaving your body to deal with that at the sametime.

Im glad you are getting some and you dont have to do 3 days on 3 days off. You can do 3 days on and take a break for longer if you want. Like 3 days on 7 days off, or 3 days on 5 days off. Just so long as you take it for more than a day and your break is as long or longer than the time you spent on it.

In Andy's book he recommends one week on, one week off, but many find 3 days is more than enough for them because chelation can be pretty heavy going. But on the net he says that a person can do it in a way that suits them. E.g. if someone is working? They may like to chelate over the weekends and leave the working week free of chelation.

The main thing to it all is the continual dose of it when you're on it and making sure you keep to the every 4 hours and waking at night to take a dose too. Some people make the mistake of doing that during the day and thinking they can skip the night doses so they can sleep. Then go back to the protocol the next day. Not a wise move, because the inconsistant stopping and then starting again will increase the risk of moving mercury into worse areas, rather than escort it out. Just the way it works apparently.

Some people get away with anything because their system is far more adept at coping with and eliminating mercury.

Thanks also for your comments. I haven't tried to get any injection of anything into my ex wisdom tooth (cavitation sites). I wouldn't know how to get such a thing...and I dont enter a dental office unless I absolutely ahve to because I get poisoned by the vapor. So that makes it hard for me to do anythign dentally. I pretty much have to avoid it.

But I can get gum treatment with an irrigator which I have used to inject the solution into the gum, which I could do on the cavitation areas, but I doubt it would penetrate enough and dont know if the stuff would be powerful enough....though it does contain colloidal silver and other things. Supposed to be for gum disease, so maybe it would help..problem too is expense. Ive just bought myself a load of supplements so sending out for this gum treatment is not cheap because when you get it, you see how tiny the bottles are (typical).

someone else suggested food grade hydrogen peroxide to inject in there, but I do not know enough about it, so wonder if that would be safe? and would that be effective?

Well DMSA is used on children and claimed to almost as safe as water (I doubt that). But certainly I am very chemically sensitive and react terribly to drugs, but to this I did not. For me at a few stages it was a literal life saver. Though it hurt me very badly onetime when I skipped a dose and redistributed mercury. But the thing is, it wasn't hte DMSA itself, it was the mercury (which has happened with other things too like a garlic supplement). So I got terrible pain in the gut from that (which I get with almost anything I do slightly wrong, so there is a bad weakness there). But the yeast diet helped me get past that.

I'm so sorry to hear on top of this, what the medication did to you and how that has also impacted your life (and strained your marriage). i have heard of that before and to be honest, I was put on medication and I had the same thing but I was not on it for long enough and it was antidepressants.

The lady who is responsible for the diet I am on (Bee, who has a website) believes that her diet and the fats can allow the body to heal from just about anything and she said that even past injuries can begin to heal. So perhaps in time things will improve for you, but also when you are sick the body tends to shut that area down more so that it can concentrate on other things it needs to focus on. I can understand that because that other area isn't exaclty life and death ...... <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/wink.gif" alt="" /> although for some people it probably is. And in honestly it is devastating but I hope that sometime, somehow that will return.

Ok, the supplemetns I am taking? The halibut oil is more powerful in vitamin A than cod liver oil, but does not have quite the vitamin D content that cod liver oil has. But it is still very good apparently. I am taking 1 or 2 caps a day, 145 mg in one capsule of halibut oil.

The fish oil I take is Omega 3 by Nordic Naturals and one cap contains 1000 mg of purified fish oil. IT says EPA - weight 300 mg and volume - 18% and the DHA - weight 220 mg and volume - 12%. So not sure exactly how good that is, but just typing out what it states.

I have not really taken colloidal silver as a supplement or anything. Andy does not seem to recommend this in mercury toxicity...not sure why.

Hi Benza, so sorry to hear about what has happened to you but mercury is like this, it makes you feel your brain has been fried and even simple tasks of working something out become near impossible. You sit there and stare at it unable to take anything in.

This is how I am most of the time, but I think my toxicity is now from other things rather than just mercury. Wow, IQ of 180???? Well, one can only hope and pray that you will be lifted out of this because the world definitely does need the genius minds for so many things. Though I wouldn't blame you if you took off and joined a monastary!!

I've felt the same myself and frankly Im not impressed by the general world either. One gets the urge to just live out there life in some kind of seclusion/peace or something where you do not have to really engage with others....but maybe that is part of my illness talking.

I dont know your circumstances, or I dont recall. So I dont know about your amalgams, how many you had, what was done and how long youve been amalgam free etc (or if you are completely amalgam free). Because a tested chelation protocol should help you if this is mercury.

Benza, I'm very sorry to hear about your situation. Are you considering mercury as the possible cause of these issues?

I have been following this for a while and I did see a small thing that might help concerning sugar addiction. I was eventually able to kick sugar cravings with raw honey. I have also helped many friends and family with this.
In fact I have found raw honey helped me heal, reduce or avoid several problems that arose from my mercury poisoning. It is no cure just something that has helped me get away from something that did not help my condition - processed sugar.

So the trick is to make sure it is truly raw and that means it cannot be heated over 96 degrees. even on the label when it says unheated and raw they can still heat it to 120 killing most or all enzymes. At that stage it is worthless and barely better than processed sugar.
Here are two brands that I and my friends have used.

http://www.reallyrawhoney.com/
the other is y & s honey

Both are on the net and available in places like whole foods. the net is about 40% cheaper. esp in bulk.
also you can go to your local bee keeper but ask if it was heated or flltered in any way.

I would replace with raw whenever I had a sugar craving. I have never seen anyone take too much or have negative effects. however we must be extremely careful in introducing new items to a mercury toxic body - I would go very slowly.

I know it is not much but in my mercury experience every bit helps.

Xylitol is really good too, costs more than sugar though so that's a factor. Both raw honey and xylitol also inhibit bacteria. If you get into a good habit of simply drinking more water your need for sugar will drop substanstially.

DMSA is great stuff but starting hard (3 days on 3 days off)on a synthetic chelator may be painful. You might ask around for other people's experiences with that. If I were just starting I would start slowly. Mercury road rage isn't pretty in the kitchen.

I wonder if Jill likes my photo. Just some context to help think about lead and cadmium poisoning... ink stained fingertips.. Acrylic resin vapors permeating brains and kidney dysfunction... urethane rashes and formaldehyde treated paneling... asthmatic seizures in pretty penthouses.

Hi sosick, just to comment about the DMSA. Taking DMSA every 4 hours may not be easy or overly convenient, but it far outweighs the reactions of intermittant doses that can cause long term redistribution side effects.

E.g. for me, taking even one capsule of 50 mg of DMSA alone with no follow up doses, was enough to send me into a terrible state that last two weeks (one capsule). Yet the every 4 hourly routine enabled me to chelate and not have to suffer such a horrific backlash and then attempt to recover from it.

Rather the every 4 hours produced typical detox symptoms of tiredness and feeling ill and drained, and just plain grotty, but nothing intolerable or frightening. It felt controlled and safer and this is why more and more people are opting for this manner of using DMSA.

I would prefer the safer use of a synthetic chelator, than the random use of a natural one. in my own experience, as a hyper sensitive to mercury, and highly toxic, natural detoxes were no better than random DMSA use. They produced exacty the same problems as eachother, because it all came down to the mercury itself, rather than the chelator. Simply by the manner the mercury is moved.

DMSA stopped doing that when it was used appropriately, though not always without detox symptoms. Of course, some may still find even this route too much and may need to use a lower dose to start.

Again, some people may not tolerate DMSA at all and may simply have to give it a miss. But I feel that the protocol of every 4 hours has been tried, tested and used by many. The fact two forums alone are devoted to this protocol and many of the members have already been injured previously by other protocols and have found this one to start helping them and improving their condition. Some have already mentioned their success on this forum.

But I agree with you, in that it is a wise move for anybody to start gently (low dose) regardless of the protocol and monitor their symptoms. If they dont like what is happening, they can stop the round, wait for a few days and start again if they wish to try a lower dose than before.

But changing the way it's taken, like extending the time inbetween doses, far from being helpful, is more risky in my experience and others also. In fact, those that may get too many side effects from every 4 hours, may even need to take it more often (every 3). Because some people use the DMSA up faster than others (metabolise it quicker) and in order to keep the levels of DMSA even in the blood, they may have to do the every 3 hours. However, every 4 seems to suit in most cases.

I prefer every 4 hours, even if I do get side effects, because I do not believe it's always possible to avoid symptoms anyway.

LOL about the picture comments!!! Actually your picture sums up how I feel most of the time.

Your pic goes well with your name SoSick. It also reminds me of how I feel during the winters here -- looking out a window, everything is grey and wet. But . . . you're not feeling so sick these days are you? What about a new pic, if not a new name? Flowers blooming? LOL

Thanks guys for the tips on the sugar. When I'm "on the sugar" I have a lot of honey. It makes no difference to me, it may be more natural, but it is still sugar, and my body treats it as such, with an insulin and an opioid response. Artificial sweeteners like xylitol are things I stay away from too. I don't honestly feel I need sweetness in my food, and just putting a tomato or two in it can make it taste sweeter to me. (You get your sensitivity to these things back when you're not bombarding your body all the time.) Honey is fine, even nutritious, for people who don't have blood sugar issues, but that is a minority of the population of the Western world.

Bex, thanks for the advice about DMSA. I think I'm pretty well set to use it correctly, I've seen you give this advice to lots of people LOL. Yes I'm prepared to take it at night. Also, if I find it is helping me, I think I've got nothing to lose by going to my GP, telling him, and asking if I can get it on the NHS. Along with a colonic. He might say no, but it's no big deal if he does.

Your fish oil regime sounds good BTW. And you could tinker with supplements. But the more I think about it, the more it seems to me that you need some specialist help with giving your body the major healing it seems to need. Whether this is looking into the possibility of cavitations, or something else, I don't know.

Yes you could try colloidal silver. It's magic stuff. When I have a cold I put drops of it in my nose and it seems to make a good team along with vitamin C. It's a powerful antibacterial agent. I suppose you could try having it injected into the cavitation area. Taken orally, I don't know, I haven't done that myself. There's a lot of info out there on it though.

I'm feeling better this morning, maybe due to the sun I got yesterday. But the grey mantle and the rain are back. It's frustrating when it's the weather that's making you poorly, there isn't anything you can do about it. It's always bothered me to an extent, but it got really bad when the clinical depression began. Sometimes I dream of getting into an airplane and getting up there into the blue, reminding myself there's still a sun.

Thanks again for the advice everyone. I think probably that mercury isn't my main issue, but I still want to get it out of my body safely and efficiently. I'll come here and say how it's going when the DMSA arrives and I make a start.

Linda.

Hi Linda, I dont go near honey in any form at all. My reactions to it are no different than they are to sugar. My Father actually orders organic manuka honey, the best in our country and I cannot eat the stuff because of my candida.

Just one of those things. At one stage I could and I felt it was beneficial to me, but not these days. So I know what you mean.

Also, concerned now about colloidal silver. I follow a particular diet as you know which comes from a website which I refer to often and has a lot of helpful information which I respect a lot.

here is what was said about colloidal silver.
http://www.healingnaturallybybee.com/articles/mn7.php

So I think I may hold fire on that for now. I know there are other things good for infections etc, like garlic (though I cannot use it in supplement form for some reason), plus oregano oil, coconut oil (which I use) etc. I dont think I will make all that much progress until the problem has been nailed. I really have made so many efforts and really I should be brimming with health. Admittedly being on this diet is better than NOT being on it. Without it I am an even bigger wreck so I do believe it works.

Yeah I do need a specialist, but I've spent so much money already on so many professionals and they are as baffled as I am over it all. There are of course things they suggest or discover, but there is nothing that really pinpoints the actual issue. So I have to pretty much try and aid many problems at once, but without ever really curing the real issue.

Like you, mercury may not be the main issue, but I think too like you that it is wise to eliminate it regardless. I am actually on chelation right now (just started today) with DMSA and ALA to see what happens. I hate waking up, but oh well. I dont expect much to occur because I was already healing from mercury years ago before this infection and other stuff hit me and crippled my health. But worth a try I figure, especially if there is residue mercury in organs and brain. ALA should take care of that (if we are to believe the claims).

Articles like that make my blood boil. They don't know what they're talking about.

Of course silver can cause the symptoms it mentions. A US Congressman is known for getting grey skin from ingesting colloidal silver. But he ingested many times more than the standard dose, for a long period of time. Anything can make you sick if you have too much of it, even water. I don't know about the nose drops the lady in the story was taking, but there's plenty of evidence that colloidal silver is safe and effective if used properly. Check out Dr. Mercola's site, he's a fan. In fact I'm glad we're having this discussion, because I've had some swelling in the skin around my eye this morning. It happens sometimes, I can end up looking like I've been punched. The doctor gives me hydrocortisone cream for it, which eventually helps after a few days. This time I sprayed some CS on my eye and the itching and swelling vanished in less than 5 minutes.

They don't know what they're talking about when it comes to colloidal minerals either. I had to check a few times and make sure I wasn't on the Quackwatch site. First of all, in a decent supplement, the minerals will all be plant-derived, which makes a big difference. For example, aluminium is toxic if ingested. However, we ingest it all the time in its plant-derived form. Fruits and vegetabes all have it. There's no avoiding it.

Just because no one has produced clinical evidence yet that certain trace minerals are beneficial to our health, that does not mean they aren't. It would be the height of hubris to say that we definitely don't need them. Soil naturally contains them until it has been drained of nutrients through intensive farming. What people should be investigating is what the effects of NOT having that wide spectrum of minerals in our food is doing to us.

My two cents' worth <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />

I tried colloidal silver about 4 times and nothing.......

Friends say the same - tried it on my cat too - had bacteria in her nails - snake eyes

Maybe orange peel and d-limonene

Thanks for, openmindedly, suggesting this SoSick.
For what it's worth, I started Andy's 4 hour protocol with DMSA and am on my 33rd round. I wouldn't want to start any other way. It was far from a painful experience. Instead, it relieved some of my symptoms. Important to emphasize, which Bex adequately does many times, start at small doses. I started at 12.5 mg. Some even have to start out at smaller doses. When I began ALA, I had to start at 8 mg.

3 days and 2 nights are what many start out with. I have been able to do 4 days and 4 nights lately. However, that is after many rounds. The benefits have far outweighed the pain. To make the waking up more tolerable, I take melantonin. It seems to alleviate some of the symptoms, because I am able to get right back to sleep after taking my doses in the middle of the night.

What have you done so far to chelate?

dmps and vitamin c Iv's +alpha lipoic acid, oral dmsa, alpha lipoic acid, NAC, chlorella sends me totally insanse so i don't use that.

also done homeopathy, psychics (i used to read for people and get paid hence i believe in it), and am ordering a biofeedback device from new zealand to monitor my stress responses over time to thoughts.

Did you go on any drugs at the same time, i.e. is that about when you started the Valium? It can cause the sorts of effects you describe.

ummm started higher doses of a lot of things starting a month after the fillings were out, it could be any of them, especially the smoking, but the pain at the back of my head is either ongoing or shock reaction from mercury expose, it seems to emanate from there causing horrific panick through my body at which time i do the doc drugs which i am totally against.

What other drugs are you taking?

dude, i don't take morpheine but if they will give it to me i will.

What is your diet like? Do you take any supplements?

meal replacement for lunch if i wake up before 3pm, and soup/normal for tea, but since my parents are away and i'm totally isolated for 6 weeks, this could get very bad very soon.

What did you have the amalgams replaced with?

very good question, one i'm worried about, some new technology, with glass in it to reflect against my teeth for the correct colour, i don't know they are white and the dentist will not speak to me after i said i got sick; law fear i guess. i could be allergic to it, in which case taking all the teeth out seems possible hey

What prompted you to get the amalgams out -- were you having any symptoms beforehand?

12 months earlier i had some chronic fatigue, it was the end of a plan to completely beat it, there was absolutely nothing wrong with me before they got drilled out, so i ruled it out as a cause of CFS and went ahead anyway just to make sure, looking for extra benifit.

Hope this helps. Brainstorming doesn't hurt and sometimes good ideas come up.

current treatments are just NAC, and a targeted homeopathic remedy to prepare my 'meridians' for the onslaught of another attempt at chelation.

Tried various natural chelators and now have to get serious with DMSA. The others did not work for me. Found a good breathing CD to get me through things - Andrew Weil - Breathing The Master Key To Self Healing
www.soundstrue.com Its amazing the bad breathing habits we pick up

FIRST THING AM – 2 large glasses water
Krill Oil – 1 capsule 15minutes before meal with some fiber or yogurt / 1 cap bedtime
Have breakfast
After meals – dandelion combo for liver – 3X day – 10 drops first 2 weeks, then 20 drops – see how feel (www.stfrancisherbfarm.com)
reservatrol - anti oxidant
Shake - Goatein and barley grass and flax fiber
500MGS B12 sublingual for a while then 1000mg
sea salt on food for minerals
After 6-8 weeks – take 6 amalgams out

Then start DMSA - 10 mgs every 4 hours - 2 days on 4 days off and see how I feel - adjust as necessary. Get to 25mgs every 4 hrs 3 days on and 3 days off. I believe that cilantro is ONLY okay to take with DMSA, the binding agent, otherwise avoid it.
After 3-4 months might add some R+-lipoic low dose every 4 hours - http://www.r-lipoic.com/

Benza,

what safety precautions did the dentist have when drillings the amalgams out?

Wow. That article about Colloidal Silver read like something I'd expect to find on Quackwatch. <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/mad.gif" alt="" /> (But thanks for sharing the article nevertheless.)

Colloidal Silver and Algin are the 2 things I'll never be without. I've used colloidal silver for years, both on myself and my cats, and my sister uses it with her whole family, kids and all.

On more than one occassion I've prevented being really, really sick from food poisoning by drinking half the bottle in one shot. I've had food poisoning enough times to know what it feels like when it's coming on, but by drinking enough colloidal silver soon enough, I've been able to stop it in about 30 minutes. For that reason alone, I take colloidal silver with me everywhere I travel.

However, your results will definitely depend on the QUALITY of the colloidal silver you use. All brands are NOT equal. I've tried cheaper brands and they just don't work as well, if at all.

(On a side note, I recently ran out of Tea Tree Oil and bought some locally. It was quite a bit cheaper, but te bottle said "pure australian tea tree oil." However, when I opened it up, you could tell it was really weak compared to what I normally use. I'll stick with the quality stuff from now on...the other was a waste of money.)

Colloidal silver acts as a broad-spectrum antimicrobial (meaning it kills all kinds of bacteria, viruses, fungus, etc.) I've used colloidal silver to get rid of eye infections, food poisoning, upset stomach, infected cuts/scrapes; my friend uses it to prevent urinary tract infections (she's diabetic and very prone to getting UTIs); my sister used it to heal cracked nipples the first time she breast fed, and she also uses it with her children to keep them from getting sick when one or the other catches something.

I've had great results using it with my cats. One cat got bit by a dog on his tail. He was gone for a few days and when he came back, you could tell gangrene was setting in. I dumped colloidal silver all over the wound and wrapped it loosely in gauze that I had soaked in colloidal silver. I put colloidal silver in his water and food, and within a few days, the infection went away, the wound healed up nicely, and his fur started growing back.

A friend of mine in Florida who's known for rescuing stray cats uses colloidal silver whenever one gets an eye infection or wound. I've also heard of a lady who puts a little bit in her fish tank when her fish aren't looking quite right. Apparently, she hasn't lost one yet.

I just love how the medical/pharmaceutical establishment loves to popularize the extremely few cases of people developing skin discoloration to make people believe it's dangerous. Of course, they forget to tell you that these folks were drinking large amounts of poor quality or "home-made" colloidal silver on a daily basis for months or years. Yes, they'd rather have you use their $50 or $100 broad-spectrum antibiotic prescription every time you get sick.

In case anyone is interested, here's the Colloidal Silver I've used for years and information I wrote about it a few years ago. I'll actually be doing more research on it in the upcoming months.

i wouldnt be without it myself. My mum got rid of a tooth inection when no other antibiotics would work. I keep it handy for all my family,even my cat has it in her water if shes poorly, it really works.

Benza abd Linda, i feel for both of you, i have been there and am still there some days. Please try not to eat sugar, its the worst thing you can do, i dont think you can detox if you have sugar. i know its hard, i gave up 2 yrs ago, i love sweet things, in fact i dream about them. i use stevia, im used to it now, i make all my own cakes, biscuits etc.
Benza, have you looked into getting your thyroid checked, sleeping that amount of time and not eating much, brain fog, all your symptoms sound like mercury has hit your thyroid. Anxiety, depression, and suicidal thought used to haunt me daily but now im on treatment im feeling better but still getting off days,cos im poisoned up to my eye balls with mercury.
Diet is more important than suplements but if you can afford both then do it, especially VitC in high doses every hour.
Personally i wouildnt chelate without being on the diet first for a few weeks,i could only use small doses of DMSA, 6mg every 4 hrs a few months ago but since being on Armour i have upped my dose to 25mg i think i could go higher but cant afford it.
Dawn

Laura, thanks for the info about colloidal silver. I wish I'd known about the uses for cracked nipples and poorly fish. From now on I'll be a bit more experimental with it <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />

Dawn, nice to talk to you. Thanks for the link to the DMSA 25mg site. My hope is that if it helps, I'll ask my GP if he'll give it to me on the NHS. Have you tried this?

I keep getting a lot of anxiety in the evenings, I don't know why. The past couple of nights it's been particularly bad. In past days I have eaten meals loaded with garlic, onions, eggs, coriander, basil, etc and been OK, haven't eaten many of those things lately. I keep saying the dreary weather must be affecting me, but it's hard to know. I hope you are keeping dry down there in the south, we're getting drenched every day!

And yes, what you say about diet is important. Thanks for reinforcing it. I work online with a naturopathic doctor and she says the same, that the number one thing you can do for your health is eat a good diet. I really have been getting awful persistant sugar cravings but it's nice to be told here to hang in there and resist. I know I'm not alone. When I'm feeling better the cravings fade. It really helps, knowing that if I ate it I'd thoroughly mess up my efforts at chelation.

Dawn, can I ask how you know your mercury levels are still high? Have you had a test done, or are you going by your symptoms?

hi linda,, no i wouldnt dare ask my doctor for DMSA, she already thinks im mad, im just about squeezing 2 grains of Armour thyroid out of her, she really does live in a bubble and thinks all my symptoms can be sorted with antidepressants, she prescribed prozac which made me so ill that i havnt got over it and its been over a year since i took the last tablet. I hope you have an understanding doctor! it helps so much if you have someone on your side.
i was never tested for mercury, i dont think theres any need, i had amalgams since childhood, vaccines as a baby which afterwards i went blue and had to stay in hospital, then loads more vaccines in my teenage years, it affected my thyroid,so had to have most of it out. I had piece of amalgam stuck in my jaw for months on end, so thet probably didnt help. I would get tested if i had more money but the last 2 yrs my health has been a money pit, apart from amalgam removal with not much protection, i had cavitation surgery, also supplements cost a bomb. if i had the money, i would get mmy adrenals tested to see where i am, rather than mercury.
I think my levels have lowered, this time last year, i was very sensetive to anything, ie,chelation, saunas, enemas but now i can do iany thing without any effects,i put it down to being on the right meds for my thyroid,it has relieved my depression alot and i can participate in life so much better now, before taking armour, i had no emotions sometimes and my poor kids suffered, but then i would get too emotional,i was so unstable, so you could say i feel alot more stable these days,i still get off days though, but thats mercury creeping up on me im sure.
Dawn

Linda, its pretty wet here too in London!

Hi, thanks for being upfront about the article. That is pretty surprising and disappointing because the lady responsible for putting it up is very up on health and her stuff is usually excellent and aided many people.

So Im taken aback. Also she is a fan of Dr Mercola, and a fan of Dr Weston Price. So really Im unsure why she's bought into that article on colloidal silver. Yes Linda it is more about a person going overboard on something that causes problems (even healthy stuff). I agree!

I think once again the proof is in the pudding. If it's helped people and even their pets? that's enough for me. I wouldn't go overboard on it obviously, and it's good to know possible outcomes if one does but it would be a pity to be onesided on stuff that can really help too.

So, you go to the doctor and they give you a prescription for either anti depressants or painkillers or cortisone or whatever. What is the main risk on the back of the bottle - do not take if liver problems

But here is the scam:

Your liver enzymes have to be so high (or is it low, I am not sure but you get my drift) under their code book to have any issues.

So the liver enzyme test shows nothing when your liver is 40% destroyed, 50, 60 70 80 90 - HEY !! at 90 something shows up in a few months or a few years after prescription drugs, but , ahhhhhh to bad you have cancer now, or something else brutle, .............and the drugs are what caused it...........

most docs dont even test before prescribing - so they give medication which hits the liver

Anti depressants for FMS or CFS - thats like giving donuts to a 400 pound person to cure his ills

Colloidal has never helped me, my pets or any friends that have taken it. I am sure it was from different sources.

I would be more apt to trying grapefruit seed extract, tee tree oil or oregano

Tea tree oil is great... I use it also, but essentials oils like Tea Tree and Oregano are not recommended for internal use (unless you use a special type of carrier, or so I've heard).

I have used Tea tree oil topically on the inside of my mouth to help heal a wound (from biting my cheek while eating) that I was afraid was getting infected. Of course, it tastes awful, which is why I like using Colloidal Silver more. Plus, Colloidal Silver can be taken internally.

In earlier post, I forgot to mention I've also used colloidal silver for canker sores, cuts, wounds, sore throat (as a gargle), and a friend of mine used it in her children's ears to get rid of ear infections.

I can't really think of anything that you couldn't use colloidal silver for.

Anonymous, I'm sorry to hear that you haven't had success with it in the past. I think it's great. If you ever want to give the brand I use a try, let me know and I'll send you a bottle at my cost. <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/laugh.gif" alt="" />

Bex, yes it can be hard to know who to trust when it comes to websites can't it. So much contrary advice around. I've heard colloidal minerals and colloidal silver praised by a number of sources I consider very knowledgeable and reliable though, and I'm happy with the facts I've found myself, I don't think anyone refutes them very well if at all. I've found Laura's comments here very helpful too. I originally bought the CS to help with the constant winter colds I was getting, but it's so much more versatile than that.

How is the chelation going?

Dawn, it's raining here again, and it's supposed to rain for the next five days . . . I think we'll need a boatd instead of a car soon. I keep wanting to get some painting done outside, fat chance.

Sorry to hear about the Prozac experience. I'm sure it didn't help. The emotional numbness you describe could be a mercury symptom but it could also be caused or intensified by the Prozac withdrawal, that's very common. My poisons were venlafaxine (Effexor) and then citalopram (Celexa). It sounds like you are doing the right things to heal your body though, and this will happen with time. Do you take B-vitamins and fish oil?

Yes, it's criminal that all our doctors can do when they don't understand what's wrong is throw antidepressants at us. And they do make a lot of conditions worse. The last time I saw my doctor, my purpose there was to get a blood test. I thought I'd also let him know what the drugs had done to me. He said he'd never heard of these complications (another typical response from a GP). When I told him I was still depressed he just shrugged his shoulders and said he didn't know what else he could do. If I hadn't taken the matter of healing into my own hands, his impotence in the face of my ongoing depression might have made me suicidal.

However, he may still be useful for getting me things on the NHS. I don't know how open he'd be to the idea. Like you said about your own GP, I think he's convinced I'm a head case, and he seems bemused by all the alternative therapies I've tried. Hey, nothing works better than drugs, right?

I'm really glad that you can see some progress and that you're feeling better these days. That must be heartening. Gives hope to the rest of us too <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />

Hi Linda, yeah I too have heard good about colloidal silver and I didn't quite buy into that article either, though I believe the majority of them from that lady are very sound and some of the best Ive come across.

The chelation is still going, but there is no change. I am not noticing anything, good or bad, so that tells me that my problems may not be mercury related at all. Usually a good test to tell if it's mercury is to take the DMSA and ALA and usually by the next day or so there are symptoms or in some cases improvements. For me there is nothing. So either the capsules are a bit past their due by date and no longer effective/potent or I may not have a mercury issue at all. I'm giving it a few more days and we shall see.

Then I will buy a new fresh batch and test myself again. I believe personally that most of my problems stems from the bacterial infection I got and subsequent problems after.

Yeah I too was put on antidepressants! I was not believed by doctors and they thought all my problems stemmed from depression and I was put on many different antidepressants. All did odd things to me, made me feel weird and unlike myself. Side effects, like numbness, dry mouth, no libido, just about anything. They didn't care, they just changed me onto another one and nothing worked.

I was also not warned about the dangers of going off them cold turkey and I was close to ending my life when I did it! I came through it luckily. And later went on the candida diet and improved and depression lifted (then). So that was a lifesaver at that time.

Sorry that others have also been through the antidepressant cycle too. SEems that it's the answer for doctors who do not know how to handle a case, and are not really willing to find out.

Double blind studies on antidepressants show that they have very little effect. but numerous side effects . Any improvement in mood tends to be in the second decimal place.One side effect ,dry mouth, makes one far more prone to tooth decay resulting in more hg exposure root canals chronic pain etc.Another fairly serious side effect is death from irregular heart beat.I think this is what killed Anna Nicole Smith"s son . In the monthes before he died , he went to doctors several times complaining of heart beat irregularities. When he died he had 10x the expected amount of antidepressant in his body fluids and even more in his tissues.Like hg , different people excrete drugs at different rates, because of differences in cytochromes.Tissue levels are often far higher than blood levels as is the case with mercury.

Drug answers are usually not the answers, but so often create further problems. Though I'll have to admit of course there are people who rely completely on their medication and swear by it. By many people have had worse occur, not just the side effects by the aftereffects or even had to go on something else becuase of the damage from the previous medication.

My Grandfather had kidney problems and was put on so much medication that it overloaded his kidneys and he died. So the very thing they treated is the very thing they pretty much destroyed. He was on that much medication.

I wish that my doctors (those that worked with mercury) would look into the patients who show the lowest levels of mercury but are often the sickest. Some of them have actually not looked into the reason for this and isntead looked at it at face value and fobbed them off. Rather than thinking about it. IF they feel poisoned and there is metallic type toxic symptoms, yet the testing shows little to no level, something isnt right. A top doctor here "Dr Mike Godfrey" was most concerned at my results in mercury testing. The levels were so low that he said this is just not normal. Healthy people have higher levels than this adn everybody is exposed to mercury in some form. He said he wanted to get my levels UP to show him my body was actually starting to push it out. So he was onto it. He called it retention toxicity. I know I've mentioned tis before, but I feel it is veryimportant to repeat because so many have this problem and give up due to testing.

Those of us who are very sick from mercury are so often the ones who hang on to it and show little to no levels. One doctor in the US understands this only too well and had a conference and spoke to doctors and explained that your SICKEST patients will be the ones showing the lowest levels of mercury. She explained why. I have the audio tapes, but as I am not educated in the science or chemistry field, so much of it was beyond me. I managed to understand the gist of what she meant however and it was very interesting.

My own doctor told me I dont have mercury because I have such low levels. I then went onto mention these audio tapes to her and she looked at me very annoyed and said YES I KNOW I WAS THERE IN THE US AT THAT CONFERENCE AT THE TIME. And I thought THEN HOW THE HECK DID YOU MISS THAT PART OF IT?????

So it's frustrating to say the least that I have had to tell my own doctor things. YEt she is the one qualified and gets paid and I look to her for the service. She also didn't even know there was a serum test to check for biocompatibility of dental materials. Yet she has all the books on mercury (some of which mention this test) and has been overseas many times re mercury poisoning and the test has been around about for a LONGGGGG time.

I personally believed that she knew and denied it because she had her own testing there at the office. This test she had brought her a lot of revenue, so of course it did not serve her to pass on this serum test info because she got nothing out of it. Again, I'm probably cynical but this doctor will pass on anything that is expensive and finances her well.

Unfortunately I'm hard up for a doctor that believes in these toxicity problems, she's all there is in my area.

That's interesting, how you've found some evidence that your body does not excrete mercury well and stores it instead. I'm sorry your current doc is being so useless. You'd think they get paid enough as it is, but so many of them want to make as much as they can on top of it. (A good example is the thousands of dollars paid in the US to doctors who promote pharmaceuticals at conferences etc.)

There seem to be a lot of people here who have tried antidepressants at some point, and had no joy with them. I imagine that's why many of them eventually found their way here. If they had felt their ADs were "working" then it's likely they never would have gone any further than that to pursue the reasons they got depressed in the first place. This defeats the whole natural purpose of depression -- to let you know something is wrong and to make you fix it.

Another side effect of effexor and other antidepressants is premature menopause

The list of side effects of these poisonous substances goes into the hundreds. Sadly, many don't manifest until the damage has already been done over the years. One of my aunts was on ADs for 10 years or so and developed Parkinsonian symptoms that were so bad she could barely hold a fork. What did the Navy doctors do who were caring for her after a distinguished career? They gave her a different AD.

I'm feeling better today, makes a nice change. And hey, I've got stars!! Things are looking up <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />

I woke up this morning with ringing in one ear. It was very noticeable in the quiet of my bedroom, though now it's hard to hear it as I'm going about day-to-day things. This wasn't a symptom I had before. Could it be mercury redistribution from chelation? It was an awful way to wake up, I felt frightened. Just last night I was thinking, "I'd feel more certain that I have mercury problems if I had a really classic symptom, like ringing in my ears."

Ugh, I wish that DMSA would come. They're making me wait a long time.

Hi Linda, this sounds much like what someone else experienced on the chlorella thread just recently.
http://herballure.com/ubbthreads/sh...&sb=5&o=&fpart=1
Go check that out, the guy on there go the same thing.

yes I'd say certainly it can be redistribution. Interesting that you brought this up! I hope it dies down soon and hope that the DMSA will help you. I hate it when it takes that long and you just want to get on with it.

i never had a ringing in the ear until starting with chlorella and cilantro. I didnt take it for months but the ringing is still there....... i would be careful with chlorella and cilantro, had terrible experience... first side effect was the ringing... then other terrible things followed. Some of the 'side effects' seem to be permanent.

Do yourself a favor and use andy cutlers protocol.

Thanks guys. This is weird.

My DMSA actually came today but they sent me 100mg caps instead of 25mg, DOH! Guess I'll be spending some time separating piles of powder and mixing them with water.

I hope I feel better with it. It's hard to know how much the HMD has helped, or as you say if it's storing up trouble for me. I have to say I do believe in finding what works for an individual, and although I know Cutler's protocol has helped many, I do not see it as being set in stone. But I will do what he says about taking DMSA every 4 hours round the clock.

I just need to decide now whether I continue with my "rest" from chelators today, or jump into taking the DMSA. Probably it would be sensible to have a little rest, but I'm keen to get started.

I'll come back and say how it's going. I'm a bit frightened, but most people here seem to have had good experiences with this stuff.

Linda.

Hi LInda, glad you got it!!! Gotta wonder why they sent you the 100 mg ones though, that is annoying.

But I do hope that it will help you. Some say it's almost as safe as water, but I doubt that. Though it is used on kids effectively for mercury and lead, so it may not be "too" bad.

No reason why you cannot start when you want. You may start to notice detox symptoms at some point into the round. It varies with me. SOmetimes I would notice it after about the 3rd dose, sometimes it would take a day before they'd start and as the round went on, they would sometimes increase and I would be ready to stop and take a break again till the next round.

I agree with you, I dont think anything is set in stone either (including this protocol)...but I think it's a good bet considering how many people are using it and responding ok to it for the most part. Not everybody, I am sure there are people who did not respond well to it and went another route.

But I think it is such a well thought out protocol and makes so much sense, and for me it did prove to be the method that suited me, being so sensitive. I just wish that I had started on a lower dose, instead of going into it too high! Also I pushed myself to do a full week of it, which I now think is a bit much and too heavy going. 3 days seems to be adequate for most.

I've taken 3 doses of 25mg DMSA so far today, 4 hours apart. I feel no different apart from being extremely irritable. It's hard on my poor little girl. A box of vitamin supplements from the US arrived today, took 3 weeks to get here, and they got part of the order wrong. A simple enough thing, but I felt like going ballistic. This is not good.

Apart from that slight ringing in the ear, I'm pretty much baseline-depression again, how I was before the amalgams came out. Maybe I ought to stop the major chelators for now and just focus on diet and supplements, carry on with the glutathione booster and the Algin.

I know it's possible to feel worse before you feel better, but instinct tells me that the way the DMSA is making me feel isn't . . . right.

Hi Linda, so it happened pretty quick! Well, that is unfortunate....I know that you can get "retracing" which is a return of past symptoms as it's drawing more mercury out and around but it is hopeful that it is done in a manner that is less wild and more tolerable and effective.

The dose maybe a little too high at this point, but again having to split pills up is also irritating. But some start as low as 6 mg or 12 mg.

You may not wish to stick it out for much longer but I hope you dont shelve it too soon! Again, you know yourself what suits best and what is tolerated. I know side effects cannot be eliminated though. They weren't with me either....only some rounds were ok, but I usually found it quite hard going. Certainly it was an improvement over the more wild random chelating.

MOstly with DMSA the types of effects I would get on Andy's protocol were tiredness, achiness, and sometimes just feeling really ill and toxic from the movement and removal of mercury. Depended on the round though.

Thanks for the report though because it's always interesting to hear how someone is going to react to this. You could always stop and keep going with the stuff you feel more comfortable with and perhaps try the DMSA again another time at a lower dose? Just a suggestion. DEfintitely dont force yourself to handle more than you can.

It's more than enough to ut up with what you have, plus attempt to actually relate to others remotely normal (especially a young child). So no wonder you're trying to go easy!

I don't know about going easy, so much as doing the right thing . . . it's hard when I still am not sure how much of an issue mercury is for me. If I knew it was actually making me ill, I'd do whatever I had to.

It's getting on toward half an hour before the next dose, and the symptoms are subsiding, which is a relief. Maybe I could try 12.5 mg? It wasn't hard to split the powder. I just wonder whether I am harming rather than helping myself. How do you know, when the chelation just makes you feel worse? When did you know, Bex, that it was helping you?

Thanks for the support <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />
Linda.

Hi linda, you are brave to take 25mg straight off, when you have mental symptoms it is best to start lower,i had to start at 6mg for a few rounds then went up to 8mg, then 12, now at 25mg. Im sure i couldnt tolerate this dose if it wasnt for Armour,my depression was too severe.You could lower your dose, i know its a pain to split up the capsules,i got the 25mg ones. Hang in there, Dawn.

Hi Dawn, it's a relief to hear from someone else who's been through this. When the anxiety gets high it's easy to get panicky.

I tried to get 25mg caps. They sent me the 100s, LOL. Oh well, since they charged me for the 25mgs I saved about £8.

I cut the last dose in half, took 12.5mg. I think if I'd been more aware of what happened with you, I would have done this from the start. I still feel a bit weird but it's not as bad as it was, and I'm not as irritable.

What really sent me into a flap earlier was some advice from the holistic health practitioner I work with online. I know she knows her stuff. After I described what I'd been doing, she said that if I didn't have mercury issues before, I've got them now because of getting the amalgams removed with no precautions, and stirring the mercury up with the chelation. She urged me to get professional help with that, and to get a test done. I'm not sure where to start -- maybe go to my GP and try to convince him to refer me for a test. I can't afford to pay a private doctor to help me with this. I'd just taken a dose of DMSA and felt panicky after I read this. I'm calmer now, but still worried that all I'm doing is making myself really sick.

She also said that tinnitus is a symptom of imbalanced kidney energy. Interesting. I wonder how one would go about re-balancing? I'm not exactly in a one-to-one relationship with this person so it's not as if I can ask her loads of questions, she's very busy with other people who are ill.

I feel rather alone and frightened. She said that removing amalgams, even with precautions, exposes a person to more mercury than keeping the fillings. Have I made a big mistake, I wonder.

Maybe you should do about 8mgs every 4 hours for 2 days on and 4 days off for a while - use enough sea salt on days off to remineralize

Whatever you do, do not stop - remember this is a 18 month journey - you will get better slowly

Breath deep whenever you can remember.........

Nordic Naturals is a good choice of omega-3 brand as they produce clean capsules, i.e. mercury free. However they are at the more costly end of the market so you may like to investigate other brands. There is a list of mercury tested brands on this website: http://www.metabolismadvice.com/omega_3_fish_oil/

Hi Linda, like you I wished I had known this earlier too when I started chelation. Though the every 4 hour routine was a much safer bet, i still feel I pushed myself too much and I was on 50 mg.

I would feel very ill by about the 4th day. Certainly after twigging about splitting capsules it became easier and 25 mg was an ok dose for me at times.

For you, it maybe wise to start much lower as Dawn did. Monitor the symptoms. I would not expect things to go smoothly because moving mercury creates symptoms for the most part. Occassionally though some can feel better during a round, but most notice aggravation and detox symptoms.

It is not usually pleasant, but for me it was a better option than the random stuff I had been doing which caused insane symptoms! Frightening.

I hope you might battle on somehow. I can tell you the symptoms from DMSA chelation for me were general tiredness, achiness, feeling grotty, and sometimes feeling very ill if I had pushed myself to go on for too long with it (like over 4 days or something). The symptoms for me at the time it was mercury appeared to increase as the round went on. So at times the symptoms might show up within a few hours after the first dose, or not show up until the next day or even two days later. I could not predict when they would start and this is the way of mercury. It is just not predictable how you will feel on each round. Every round can differ from the next.

Thanks regarding the fish oil Anon. I use a brand from the US called Carlson's.

And thanks again for the advice Bex. I seem to be getting on with the 12.5mg doses of DMSA so far, though these still seem to be hard on my system, particularly the adrenals. (That system hasn't been working properly since the antidepressant withdrawal and is sensitive to everything.) However the symptoms are manageable, and it's very early yet but it's possible that I've already been helped a little bit. I don't know. I'm still worried about what my naturopath said to me, she really seems to think I've screwed myself over.

I'll finish this round and see where I stand. Waking up at night and again early in the morning to take doses isn't much fun is it. I'm pretty tired.

Hi Linda, please dont take the person's words too much to heart about the exposed removal. If it is any consolation I had half of my mouth done like that by a general dentist and was no worse off than I was when I had the rest done by a biologic dentist. Odd because I had all the protection on the last removals, yet was very very ill.

I do not believe that mercury vapor can really be protected against efficiently because it penetrates through anything (even walls) but of course it's wise to do what one can anyway to perhaps frustrate it as much as possible.

You are not the only one whose had a removal done exposed like that and yes it can indeed worsen a person but chelation can cure a person also.

I was healing from that, it took a long time yes but I was recovering well and truly. You don't tend to notice it at the time, bear that in mind. It takes time.

My infections are what ruined me, more than the exposure to mercury.

I know, the waking up at night can be awful, especially when you are in the state where you are sleeping heavy and need it. That's when you feel absolutely desperate. This is why only 3 days of chelating is probably the best way, rather than an entire week.

I hope the 12.5 mg continues go be remotely tolerable. main thing is hopefully getting some of the accessible mercury out of you in a more balanced and smoother manner. here's hoping.

Also it can start helping relatively quickly believe it or not! So long as you are supporting your body with good diet etc and not pushing yourself to go too far or too much. Overwhelming defeats the purpose and if anything can hinder progress by flooding the body with too many toxins at once. Going easier allows the body to catch up more.

I'll say it again Bex, you've given a lot of good advice to people here. I wish we could help you more. Have you got any plans for what you will do next?

I can't believe how I'm feeling this morning. I keep wanting to sit and take it all in. It's like, "oh yeah, this used to be how it felt to be alive." I've had little windows like this before, and of course I'm not feeling "normal," but something significant seems to be going on. That usually seems to be when I am headed for a crash . . . I hardly dare to believe it is real. I've just dropped my daughter off at pre-school and am considering putting the radio on (BBC Radio 4, lots of talk, like American NPR) and picking up some crochet. I haven't been able to do these things for the last 6 months.

It's too early to make any judgements yet. It seems to me I've been here before, always to be disappointed. But certainly I will stick with the DMSA and see how things go.

Keeping fingers crossed <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />
Linda.

Hi Linda, thanks again for your thoughtfulness in my regard. I think that my problem is too difficult, one that will not be simply resolved by diet or chelation.

Right now though, I am still sticking to my diet and I am finding it particularly horrible. in fact, I have just had an awful bout of crying. Drugged state all day and now weeping. I am that ill I am almost beside myself. I feel personally that my cheats over a long period of time have allowed toxins to accummulate and I'm feeling the brunt of it. I am on the verge continually of giving in again, but another part of me is persisting. Perhaps if I keep this up, the accummulated toxins will erupt outwards and maybe then I will feel a bit more myself again. If that does happen, next step is the dentist for composite replacement (if all goes well).

But again I simply cannot do a thing in my state. Not even possible. I can barely function, much less go into a toxic dental office and be exposed to a load of vapor. Two edged sword I'm afraid.

My body just hangs onto toxins like a magnet and this is ruining my life.

I really hope you a victorious in this battle! I truly do believe the bits of DMSA will be more significant than you realise. My doctor said to me it's about chipping away at it, taking a break and doing it again and so forth. This is not a race, but a uphill grind and you may find yourself up and down. One moment feeling better, then down again and so on. It seems to be this way. I wish it was a smooth upward climb to improvements but it seems to be all over the place. DMSA should somehow aid and quicken this process.

I would not increase the dose until you are completely comfortable with the idea. If you feel yu are no longer getting any effects, (increased symptoms), then you may wish to try a larger amount. But again, your body can only excrete as much as it can excrete and the rest is re-absorbed until the next round.

No thoughts about taking bigger doses, believe me, LOL. This is enough for now. Besides, other things being well, I imagine it's a good sign that less seems to be more. I'd rather not ever have to be taking 100mg or upwards of DMSA.

I'm sorry you're having such a hard time right now Bex. I've been there with the crying, and the constant desire to cheat on the diet. It's an awful experience. I was just wondering, as you said, maybe the way you feel right now is connected to the virus you had. Do you know anything about what its nature was? Could it be something like EBV? Have you tried giving your immune system a big boost? Why not try taking vitamin C to bowel tolerance for several days, and combine it with a good-quality colloidal silver. See if you can kill anything still lurking. Are there no naturopaths around that look like they could help?

My personal suspicion is that you've got the mercury out of your system that was bothering you. I would look elsewhere for answers. I wish I could tell you what they were, but you seem to be a person who is intelligent, resourceful, and determined. Please let us know how you get on.

Best wishes,
Linda.

Thats like saying you shouldn't quit smoking unless you have cancer. Its doing invisible damage the whole time.
If proper protocol is used, you will suffer much less Mercury exposure that you would by leaving them in. Your mouth is dammed up so you can't swallow it, a vacuum is used for the vapor and the material, and you are being fed oxygen. It's a one time exposure that is kept to a minimum and then its done with. Keeping them in you expose yourself hundreds of times a day.

And you are experiencing mercury symptoms. Depression is one of the foremost symptoms. Any chemical/hormonal imbalance can be caused by Mercury. Weight problems (apart from poor diet/eating habits) can be mercury. Insomnia, fatigue, acne, mood swings, the list goes on forever. Look at the years since this substance has been used is people's mouth. Depression is at an all time high, Fibromyalgia, Chronic Fatigue, Bipolar, MS, Autism, all of it at an all time high. You didn't see a fraction of this 50 years ago. Yes they have all existed for a long time, but so has mercury poisoning through other sources than your teeth.

You made the right decision in removing them, you have to make the right decisions with detoxing as well, or you can exacerbate your symptoms. Don't be afraid to try Alpha Lipoic Acid. I as well as Russ on this forum seem to get a bit euphoric from it, where as DMSA makes me feel down. I combine the two to be more effective because its tolerable, but you could do the ALA by itself, just start very small. As for your reaction to it, each round I do, days 1 and 2 are spacy, irritable, depressed, scared and anxious, around day 2.5 -3.5 I start to feel like I'm on top of the world. This continues for 3-5 days afterwards. This happens each round, w/out fail. You may need to just push through it (use your judgment) I would also incorporate Algin, it seems to make a big difference with me and the symptom control.

I disagree with the mentality "if its not causing you problems, don't mess with it" For it most likely is causing you problems you just don't know about them yet. However if you are showing symptoms that are mercury toxicity possiblities, get it at the source, or atleast eliminate that possibility and go from there.

This is a lot of food for thought Claythrow. Thanks. I've been taking Algin, and I do plan to take ALA too, but I think it would be safer to wait a few months first. I seem to be OK with the DMSA now. Maybe I started at too high a dose and it was a shock to my system. Thanks to the advice here, though, I persisted at a lower dose and it hasn't been a problem. It was wonderful to actually feel a bit better this morning.

You know, there's so much contrary advice out there. Sometimes it's hard to know what to believe. I have put a lot of trust in my naturopath, she has a great deal of knowledge and has helped many people stop taking poisonous drugs and rebuild their lives. I take seriously anything she says. But Bex also said that while mercury damages, chelation heals. Now that I've gone half a round with a dose of DMSA I can handle, I'm beginning to think I'm doing OK for myself so far.

But is it mercury? This is the big question. Many people who come to that drugs list have suffered depression and worse. Many find their depression lifts when they clean up their diet and take appropriate supplements. The power of these things to heal is immense. Nutritional deficiencies lie at the heart of many illnesses. Sometimes people need to dig a bit more deeply. Life situations, and ways people react to them, can also cause depression.

Let's not forget that in the past several decades, the standard Western diet has deteriorated further. Cheap processed junk is more common and widely available than ever before. These foods are full of white flour, sugar, and chemicals such as MSG, to name just a few. We are sold pasteurised homogenised milk to drink, which has been denatured by these very processes. Most American meat comes from animals raised on feedlots, fed unnatural diets and pumped full of hormones. Plenty of foods still contain hydrogenated vegetable fats, which are deadly and should be banned. If these are not used, then the next choice is usually polyunsaturated oils, which easily go rancid, are unstable in cooking, and severely imbalanced in their omega fats ratio. Now, more than ever, people need their fruit and veg, but even these are losing their nutrients due to intensive farming.

Hm, sorry got on a soapbox there, this is one of my pet subjects. But it does stand to reason that if people go through a lifetime of eating this way, the vast majority of them will eventually become ill. Mental illness is a very common symptom. Yes mercury can cause depression, but so can a hundred other things, and I think it's worth taking a hard look at one's life and overall state of health before jumping to conclusions. The first conclusion I jumped to, myself, was SAD. All the symptoms were there. I did light therapy to death, as if my very life depended on it. It was a long road I took in coming here, and I'm honestly not yet convinced that I've found the answers. I think all I might need is a job, with all the things that entails -- getting out of the house, adult contact, personal satisfaction, intellectual stimulation, money.

But I'm also willing to carry on pursuing chelation just in case. If I round a corner and it begins to seem obvious that the chelation is really helping me to improve, I will come here and say <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />

Linda.

You have your fillings out correct?

Yep, about 2 1/2 weeks ago.

I spoke to the nurse at my doctor's surgery this morning. She said the doctor would refer me to the hospital for chemical tests. I don't know which ones. She gave me a smile and used the sort of tone that says, "everything's OK now, the doctor is taking care of it." **shudder** I think this must be a good thing, though I wonder what's in store <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/confused.gif" alt="" />

I was better on my first DMSA round than off. The past couple of days I've had upset stomach, fatigue, and quite a lot of anxiety. Looking forward to starting the second round tomorrow.

Well it's been 2 weeks since I saw the doctor, and no sign of any test dates coming through the post. Does it really take this long in the NHS just to get a test date, let along the actual test? It's a good thing I don't feel like I'm dying, sheesh.

I'm on day one of my 4th round of chelation. I took 12.5mg of DMSA every 4 hours for the first two rounds, then was able to up it to 25mg on the 3rd round without any problems. Back in the 2nd round I tried adding a little ALA, just 12.5mg to match the DMSA, but got very irritable and depressed and decided I'm not read for that yet.

Strange how things all change. I've been pretty steady, whether I'm chelating with the DMSA or not. Last round symptoms were minimal. Today, let's say they're quite tolerable, but calling attention to themselves. There seems to be a standard package of them for me: fatigue, brain fog, loss of appetite, sort of like I've got flu. Maybe it's just one of those things. Everyone seems to say that one day can be very different from the next, and there can be good days and bad.

I think I've seen evidence enough that I've got at least some mercury, and that it's coming out with the chelation, so that's good. I think it's going to take getting a job for the depression to really lift though. Tricky when you're a teacher and it is the middle of the summer. I'm going on a return to teaching course this autumn if no employment pops up, and I'm sure I'll enjoy it, but heavens it would really help to have some money too.

I can't say I feel better or worse overall, hard to tell. Just plugging along. I'm feeling the chelation today, that's for sure.

Linda.

hi veggiejuicer: have you ever check into being an online teacher or tutor position in your area ,some teachers in our area have started doing this type of work in there off time working from there own homes ?

I emailed an agency once that was advertising for tutors. Once they found out I was a teacher they said I was exactly the kind of person they didn't want, and that if I tried to apply at their site or anyone else's they would blacklist my name. I've never got such a horrible email from anyone. You'd think that parents would like the person tutoring their child to have a teaching qualification. Maybe they thought that as soon as I got a job, I'd ditch whatever kid I was tutoring. But thier attitude put me off completely, and also made me wonder if I know absolutely nothing about the business and how it works.

I've tried various things. Last autumn I worked as a teaching assistant for 6 weeks. It was 4 full days at school per week. Unfortunately the overstimulation problems from the drug withdrawal got to me. Even though I carried earplugs with me, they weren't enough protection from music classes, out-of-control drama classes, and bells ringing near me. My depression lifted significantly, but the cortisol problems were too much and I had to quit.

I looked for months for a quieter, less demanding job in a shop, or doing clerical work. Didn't get interviews. I felt I had to put on my CV/resume that I'm a teacher, which probably put them right off hiring me.

I do actually want to be back working in a school, but I want it to be part-time and that's the big problem. I want to be here for my daughter, I don't want both her parents working too hard and being too short on time and energy. Besides, even if I wanted to work full time, I couldn't because of the overstimulation.

If i can't get anything after the course, I'll have to do substitue/supply teaching and hope I can make some contacts. I think I'm a pretty good teacher to tell the truth, but they make it very hard to get back into my profession after having a baby. I've asked myself many times if there's something I'd rather do, but there's a lot about teaching that appeals. And it pays decently.

I keep hoping that sooner or later something will turn up <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" /> Part of me believes that I've learned all the lessons I've needed to at this point, goodness knows it's been an intensive three years, and I'm ready for a break. I guess many people here could say the same.

Anyway, one day at a time. I'm still pretty yucked out tonight, hoping tomorrow will be better. At least the irritability isn't there this time, and anxiety is only low level. Don't know why my body is reacting so much at the beginning of this round, when the last one was smooth sailing. The biggest problem I actually have is that the DMSA makes it hard for me to sleep. I take it at 10pm and 2am, and my sleep is rubbish. Usually I don't take the 2am dose on the third night, but the 10am one still seems to ensure that my sleep is fitful.

Anyway, I am thankful that I have less to complain about than many others here. It could be a lot worse.

This round has got progressively harder. I'm struggling today. There are some serious things in my life that need dealing with at the moment, and I'm not in a very good condition for it. Pretty fragile and prone to tears. I'll be finished with the round tonight so I may as well put those last several hours in.

The last round wasn't like this at all. Could my body maybe need more than 3 days between rounds, now that I am on 25mg instead of 12.5mg DMSA? The pervading sense of hopelessness is maybe the worst thing, it just feels like everything is going wrong and there is no hope or help. My mind knows differently.

Could my body also be reacting to the DMSA? It is pretty stimulating for me, makes it hard to sleep, and at the moment I'm rather jittery and can feel my heartbeat.

In a word, yuck!

hey you went to a regular dentist too right
? did you do anything to make sure there weren't any traces of the amalgams left or would it be okay to chelate even if theres a few bits here and there?
i got some of mine removed but still have a few more and my doctor was not a holistic dentist.

I saw your other post here. Are you sure that you have bits of amalgam left? Can you see them? Bex recommended an X-ray, that sounds like a good plan to me if you are worried.

no not really but i just want to make sure i guess, but not in the mood to spend extra money. if other people have used a regular dentist without double checking to see if there were traces left and had decent results with chelation i guess i'll hold off on the x-ray until i have a bit more money. i hate money and its problems.

Hi linda,chelating is very hard on the adrenals,maybe 25mg is too high!
im thinking of going back to 12.5mg when i start chelating again.
i have suspicions that there is still a certain amount of mercury left over whenever amalgam is removed unless you went to hesham who tests for this. Im only talking minute amounts that may not be seen on xray.
dawn.

Thanks Dawn. It's important to listen to your body isn't it. I might drop back down to 12.5mg for the next round, see how I go. Yes it is hard on the adrenals, I think that's definitely responsible for some of the symptoms I'm having.

Linda.

Hi Linda, you can take much more of a break than 3 days. Some people do 3 days on and then take 7 days as a break. Whatever you need to do to cope a bit better.

But yes the dose itself maybe too high at this point as Dawn said. Andy recommends supplements when doing this because he believes not taking them is just making it far harder. His recommendations are vitamin C, vitamin B complex, milk thistle, magnesium (taken 3-4 times a day so they will be effective enough) and taking zinc, vitamin E, once or twice a day.
with this he recommends flaxseed oil (about 1-2 tablespoons a day, which can be mixed into yoghurt or cottage cheese etc). Also borage oil is a good one to take along with flaxseed.

Hi Bex,

I'd maybe be interested in getting Cutler's book at some point, but it's a lot of money isn't it. I'm not sure how relevant it is to me yet.

Thanks for the advice, yes I was thinking about maybe taking a longer break between rounds this time. I can do without 3 more days of being depressed and anxious.

I take a good, wide variety of supplements so no problems there. I've been planning on looking into the milk thistle. It would be good to support my liver I'm sure, but I'd like to find out what milk thistle's other effects are in the body first. I have to be a little more careful about this kind of thing than mst people because of the drug damage.

I take a good fish oil, was the flax for omega-3? It actually provides mostly ALA, which the body can convert into a small amount of DHA and EPA (most people don't realise how small this amount is, and think plant sources such as this are good sources of omega-3). I wonder if Cutler recommends it because of the ALA?

Anyway, I'm going to enjoy a DMSA-free day and try to relax <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" /> It would be nice if the sun came out for a little while. We'll all be going around in rowboats here at this rate.

Linda.

I thought I would try doing this last round with ALA alone. I always prefer to do things "naturally" and although DMSA seemed to be OK with me, I'm aware that it does rob the body of minerals, and it's expensive to boot. I was hoping to stand a chance of getting some after having a mercury test of some kind done, but it's been over a months since my doc said he'd refer me and I still haven't heard anything about that.

I felt no effect whatsoever after doing a day of 25mg ALA doses, so I thought I'd try going up to 50mg. (Previously I'd been having 25mg each of DMSA and ALA.) Yesterday I was fine with that but today has been a doozy, it's been really hard. I managed to get through without panicking or stuffing my face with sugar because I knew what was going on and I knew it would pass.

I'm just wondering what to do next. I'm starting to lose heart with all this. It's hard to know what's going on inside my body and what's going to help. I can say with certainty that my worsening of symptoms upon amalgam removal has gone, and I'm really pleased about that. I suspect, though, that I continue to feel depressed because my life just sucks right now and it's been a very long sturggle to try to change it. At times when I've been happier for whatever reason, I felt the depression lift briefly. I'm wondering how much help continued chelation will really be, because on days like this it takes a lot of motivation to keep going.

If anything, the brain fog is worse rather than better Might I need to take the DMSA along with the ALA? I'm a bit confused there. I'm told that the usual protocol is to take them together but Bex says a lot of people can take ALA alone.

If brain mercury is a problem and you're ready to take ALA, do you usually start feeling a benefit from it fairly early on? Can people who take ALA as a normal supplement do it without having any trouble -- does the fact that I feel this way show that I really do have more mercury to come out? I was thinking that maybe taking 400mg a day or so of ALA would be a really good addition to a supplement regime, but I don't think I dare take a couple of large doses in the day, I don't want to risk making myself sick.

I've said it before -- there's just so much guessing involved in this. What the NHS has to offer here seems more pathetic to me all the time, it's no "help" at all.

Linda.

Hi linda,its just an idea but have you had a full thyroid test, not TSH. This maybe why your feeling this way,its not always mercury in the brain,and low thyroid gives brain fog,depression, cravings,to name a few.
If you are considering a test, make sure you ask yourdoc to test for a full thyroid panel,they usually only test for T4 which is bloody useless. I had to tell my so called doctor i wanted all the tests done, they havnt got a clue,
I wouldnt rely on the NHS, they are useless, you probably have some mercury inyour body but im guessing it has attacked your thyroid. dawn.

That might be true Dawn. I was hoping that if I chelated well, my thyroid would overcome whatever problems it was having. It's hard to tell but I can see for sure that I am very fortunate in not being as ill as some others on this list, and it isn't clear how much these things might be affecting the depression. If I thought it was very likely that they were causing it I would probably take more action. As it is, my next step in that direction may be to wait another 6 weeks or so until I can start my return-to-teaching course, see if the depression starts to lift. If it doesn't then I will pursue other avenues like thyroid, more chelation etc.

I did ask for a thyroid test last time I saw the doc but all they did was TSH, how useless is that. Next time I would insist on T3 and T4. I also asked for hormones like estrogen to be tested but they said they don't do that unless they suspect a tumor. ??????

I am sat here wondering if I am feeling yuck today because the 50mg of ALA was rather a shock to my body, or because it isn't doing me much good on its own and I need DMSA with it. This has been a reminder of what things were like last winter, and that I've been doing rather better since: more motivation, clearer head, able to keep things ticking over OK. I posted some listings on eBay tonight that I'd pre-prepared and it's good they were already ready because i think I would have been too foggy tonight to put them together.

Guess I'll see how I feel in the morning, this round is almost done. I'm a little frightened. I hate the foggy brain more than anything else. When I initially started the ALA a few rounds ago it seemed to help to clear it a little.

Linda.

hello linda,

if you dont have the cutler book you get a lot of information here:

http://home.earthlink.net/~moriam/

and join this cutler chelation support group: They have great chelation advice, how to supplement, thyroid, adrenals etc.

100% free....

http://health.groups.yahoo.com/group/frequent-dose-chelation/messages

Hi Linda, I'm sorry to hear this. You may require longer with the DMSA. Some people do. Take heart, some have recovered on DMSA alone, which may indicate most of their mercury is in the body areas, rather than brain.

Depression isn't always a sign of brain mercury, so you may want to keep chelating with DMSA and ALA together.

Andy says that DMSA does not chelate out any minerals whatsoever. This is a common misconception. It is the action of the chelating itself that can use up minerals and antioxidants more rapidly because of the stress. So this is why a person would do well to supplement the entire time, during and between chelating.

I know DMSA is expensive, but if it helps? If you can find a way of getting it, I probably would. It may just help keep things a little more stable, plus continue to chelate other areas at the sametime. Though ALA does it "all", some find they require DMSA to keep an even stronger grip on the mercury once ALA has pulled more mercury out of the organs/brain.

It is different for people, so you never know how anybody willl respond. I hear some do badly on DMSA and great on ALA and some vice versa. You maybe able to do ALA alone at some point, but maybe now your body feels better using DMSA at the sametime.....

Make sure you're getting enough antioxidants/minerals during this, that can get people down as well. Also getting enough fish oil/flaxseed oil for essential fatty acids, which aid in healing up the brain apparently.

Unfortunately ALA will not suppress symptoms (usually), it will cause you a feeling of regression, as though you're going back to how you were. Brain fog is another one. Though you get the odd person who claims a sense of euphoria, most feel as though they are going back to how they were and feel like giving up.

So it is very very hard to keep going when this occurs. 50 mg is actually a big step! And half the problem is this, you may not notice anything at first whilst your taking it, but symptoms usually start to happen later on and grow. So be careful. It can take a few days sometimes before the symptoms start and you start feeling really down to it. It can be a subtle onset.

hi linda, normally when you have low T3 which i did,nothing could make me happy,even if i won the lottery it wouldnt make me happy, it certainly wasnt my lifestyle,and i hated docs who asked me what i was depressed about, i loved my life,i felt like they insulted me.

Hi LindaLou:

You struggle sounds a lot like mine. I am on Armour Thyroid low dose, and I think the extra T-3 helps. But sometimes I want off this too. I am hoping if all the mercury is gone, I won't need it.

My amalgams were replaced 14 months ago. I have been on Cutler's method of chelation, every 3 hours - for quite a while I have been on 50 mg ALA and 25 mg DMSA. In total, I have done 25 three day rounds of ALA and DMSA, and 39 total rounds, the first being 25 mg DMSA only. I tried recently to up to 100 mg ALA, and felt great at end of round, but day later crashed - though it could have been the heat that did it. So back to 50 mg.

You know, looking back, I had some days where I did not want to get out of bed - dreaded the thought of starting the day. These have passed! OK, it's still not all fun and joy, but it is way better than it was. I think this will happen for you too.

Cutler says each time you chelate, you remove like a half or one percent of the load from your brain. So, you may want to hang in there and keep going, but I know for me, I too sometimes want to quit. But then supposedly, you never get the mercury out of your brain.

To cope, I take breaks for a few weeks here and there. It's a long, slow game as Russ says. But I believe the progam works. There are symptoms that have really gone away - some things that prove to me it was absolutely mercury causing this. The absolute proof for me was frequent urination, getting up 4 to 6 times a night, absolutely went away within a day of getting the final amalgams out!! Wow! No way could it have been anything else. That alone was worth the price of admission. I don't have to run to the bathroom all day long anymore - and that was going on for over 20 years. Huggins and Cutler write about this, and I believe they are correct. When I hear of a doctor or dentist who laughs and dismisses mercury poisoning as unreal, I kind of want to ask them to explain how that happened!

You say you are doing better now than last year - I take that as a sign it is working for you. I think I may try ALA only soon, and see how that works, maybe use Algin with it.

Good Luck; I wouldn't doubt if you feel great again someday,

TW

linda, chelating is very hard on the adrenals, so i would go slow, especially if your not supporting them. Dawn.

Dawn, yes I think this is part of the reason why I feel yuck when I chelate, DMSA or not -- it's hard on my adrenals. I take some herbs to lower my cortisol, it's in a bit of a miess anyway because of the drug damage. Do you have any suggestions for what else I could do?

Tumbleweed thanks for sharing your story. I'm really glad you're feeling better, it's great to hear stories of success. As for me, my depression has a seasonal element and I always feel a little better at this time of year. At this time last year I was actually still "high" on my newfound nutritional knowledge and diet, and believed those things alone might heal me. With that belief came hope, and that helped a lot. This summer I know there's more to it than that and it rather feels like I've dug my feet in for the long haul.

Anon thanks for the link. For now I think I might stay here though. Lots of people here are knowledgeable and I think with their help I'll have the answers I need.

Thanks for writing Bex. No worries about supplements, I take plenty. Thanks for clearing up the question about mineral depletion. And also the brain fog. It's been about 6 hours since my last dose and things seem to be settling now, thank goodness. I'm still irritable and rather low, but not like yesterday, and my mind is more clear. My biggest fear was that the awfulness was setting in to stay, that I was doing myself damage. I'm sure you know this all too well, but when you've had a taste of feeing a little better, that somehow makes it twice as hard to be dragged back down into the mud again. However, if I thought it was necessary in order to actually get better, I think I'd get through it.

My biggest question is just always, Is mercury a problem for me? The symptoms I have could be mercury-related, or not. It seems telling that when I've had moments of happiness, it's lifted a bit. When I was able to work for 6 weeks last autumn, then despite the fact that I was in cortisol overload hell (which is why I ended up having to quit), I felt good enough mentally and emotionally to start thinking I didn't feel depressed anymore, and to consider picking up some of my old hobbies again, like ghost hunting with a local group of friends. This lasted a couple of days after I quit the job and then BANG, the awfulness was back again, full force.

The other symptoms I have could well be tied to the depression, and the resultant changes that's made in my biochemistry. My naturopath thinks the depression is endogenous -- tied to my life. I've had to learn the hard way that my ideals of motherhood have just not fitted the reality for me. I wanted to devote most of my time to joyfully raising my little girl, and if we could have afforded it I would have done some home schooling. What's happened has been that I've found my own life very constrained, almost to nonexistence; I am Shelly's mum, not "me." We have almost no help from family and friends, my husband and I almost never get time together without her, and I have little of that by myself -- two hours when she was at pre-school four days a week, and now day after day of unrelenting child minding. I am bored, I am lonely; I don't really know other mums. I need money, I need mental stimulation, and I can't get a job. I am not listing this in the hopes that people will feel sorry for me, I know that everyone has troubles of their own. But I think it's a plausible illustration of why I continue to be depressed. I get very little joy out of life and don't even enjoy playing with my daughter much because we're joined at the hip and we never get time apart. The only emotions I ever seem to feel are irritability and anger.

Mercury may be mixed into this somewhere but it's just hard to see the big picture. I think I will see how I go over the next few days, how I recover from the last chelation round. If that goes well I think I'll keep trying in the hopes that it will help.

Thanks everyone for the support <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />
Linda.

linda, you could lower the doses to 12.5mg which i was doing for quite a few months at first. celtic or himalayan sea salt,half tsp twice a day is good for adrenals.
I too am having difficulties,my adrenals have gone beserk,i had alot of stress recently, it might be that,im trying to chelate again with DMSA, its a nightmare, Dawn. P.S,do you suddenly feelvery hot, this is a sign of high cortisol,im getting that bad at the moment.

Hi Linda, it is really hard sometimes to know what depression is exactly related to, - underlying illness or simply disastisfaction in life (or both perhaps...). But to me? you are at least doing something to try and find a way to hopefully lessen the problem, even if it isn't mercury at least you are addressing it in case there is some factor there.

You must feel really isolated and I feel profoundly sorry that you do not have enough people around you where you get more adult and outside stimulation and those that could come and visit or family/friends babysitting and giving you and your husband time together. I "try" and do this for my brother and his wife, because I see the strain and see that they simply 'keep going" but you can tell they get NO time for eachother.

Kids are a parents life, I know that, but I still feel that extended family who can help out and relieve, would do well to do this more often, because I think people like me who are not married and do not have kids, actually have the means to be an aid to others who ARE.

I actually feel useful when I can do this, it's rewarding that I feel like I can help. I wish you had this!!!!

But I do know that illness like this can be subtle and it may seem to lift when your mind is off things, but at the sametime, if you were truly healthy? You would find it very hard to get down to it. This is what I have found anyway. When I feel really well, I find things that normally upset me and leave me feeling disastisfied and depressed, no longer seem to have the impact...so it really hard to know for you if it's totally related to circumstances, or there is a toxic motivation going on here as well, somehow emphasising the feelings of depression and isolation, whereas normally under completely normal health you may find it harder to feel that way.

I just hope that you start to pick up more, that perhaps it was a bad chelation round for you (you get them too). Maybe you do need to do more DMSA......

Bex you have a big heart, I have thought this since I started reading your posts here. I was expecting at various points to hear from people, "You're depressed because you haven't found Jesus" or "You chose to be a parent, this is what it is to be one, did you think it would be a picnic," or even "there are people here who are so sick they are suicidal so get a grip." Thank you for your understanding response. I think your brother and his wife must be very thankful for what you do for them, and I bet the little tyke loves the attention from you! Little Shelly always loves someone new to play with.

You're right about depression. When a person isn't depressed, where is the motivation to change anything in their life, unless they are ill? Depression forces you to take a long hard look, and to make those changes, because you don't want to spend another moment in that state. I just wish I'd realised the cause a long time ago. And I'm happy to do things that will imporve my health in the meantime because they can't hurt and they might help.

I'm going to need to change what I do on the next chelation round, that's for sure. The DMSA/ALA combo seemed to work OK for me so maybe I'll stick with that for a while. I'm still dealing with the after-effects of the last round. I am tired, low, and very unmotivated today. I ought to take Shelly out to the park or something but I can barely drag myself around the house. All I want to do is eat sugar. So far I'm winning the battle but the cravings are terrible. I know that if I ate it, it would lead to a binge that was expensive on my pocketbook and my health. Sometimes it's just so tempting to say "no" to the awfulness and grab a break, even in a destructive way, but I've learned enough about where that leads not to have given in yet this time.

I do love my little girl, a lot. I just wish things could have been different. She needs to be with other people who can offer her other things. Same with me. It's summer holidays and we're stuck in the house without a car a lot of the time. Neighbours and friends are busy. We've been out to museums and fun parks, and to shops when I have the car, but that's about all I can do, I can't take her to Disneyand every day. Whoever invented the idea of summer holidays off school must have been nuts. (Will I be saying this when I am actually teaching again I wonder.)

Well, life goes on, and it's up to us to make the most of what we have. I'm glad you guys are here to talk to, it really helps. And good luck with the ventilation people Bex <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />

Linda.

The way I feel now is similar to how I felt when I had the amalgams out. Other symptoms have reappeared that I haven't had in a while, including some achy joints, hot flushes in my head and ears, upset stomach/nausea, anxiety, as well as the general fatigue and feeling of lowness. I'm pretty sure now that I'm going to need to have DMSA with ALA from now on, I think the ALA on its own was a mistake (though with this all being guesswork, usually I don't suppose you know til you try).

I don't want to go through more days of feeling like this than I have to, I want to start getting rid of any mercury that was stirred up and is causing me to feel rough. Since I didn't have DMSA with my last round (which ended yesterday), could I start another round tomorrow? Would that be an OK thing to do? I'd like to feel that I'm starting to put this right.

Linda.

I think a big problem is that people on this forum do not have patience - they dont look at the big picture 2 years out. Think about how great you will feel in 2 years when all the mercury is out, and then it will happen.

In the meantime hold yourself over with good supplements. (krill oil, vitamins, minerals, greens) If you think adrenal is a problem this sounds good: http://www.elixirs.com/products.cfm?productcode=GL217A
Try it for 2 weeks, if feel okay then continue, if not then quit. Can only try.

DMSA 50 mgs every 3-5 days with some cilantro liquid - no ALA

Hi Linda, thanks a lot for the kind compliments, could apply them to you also!

I think you could start another round tommorrow if you wanted to. It may help stabilise some of what the ALA did. I wonder whether personally that you still have a little too much mercury in the tissues/blood ? That might be why ALA on its own needs the aid of DMSA to help at this point. To be honest, i found ALA with DMSA much better. I had problems on ALA alone, but I think that was because I had too much metals floating around still and needed the stability of DMSA.

I still feel you may well have a mercury problem. Reason I say that is, it's interesting that your symptoms worsened when you first tried DMSA on a too high a dose for you. Usually when you get an exacerbation of symptoms like that with a chelator, that's pretty evident.

As Andy said, ALA unfortunately usually causes a feeling of going back to how you "were" and your old symptoms return. So you feel like not only are you not getting anywhere, but you're regressing. Some people can be the opposite and feel better ON ALA, but this is not the case for others. It can really get you down apparently.

I hope that another round or so will improve the symptoms from the last one. I just wish DMSA was not as expensive! You know there are people who have been cured by DMSA alone and never even used ALA, so it is possible.

HI Anon, I know what you mean but unfortunately mercury can have an effect on a person's mind in such a way to cause a feeling of despair and "doom" and two years is a long time when one is going through hell.

I have had 20 plus years of illness so far. But had amalgams out by age 24 and did not do any real active chelating at that stage (which I now wish I had). Once the symptoms began to worsen by age 27 (nightmare time of the stored mercury beginning to erupt out) it then took two years of unadulterated hell of symptoms whilst my body attempted to eliminate the stored mercury. I took many different types f chelation and often with devastating reactions, all to try and get the stuff OUT and hopefully speed up the prolonged agony.. By age 29 I did start to feel I was recovering, and was much happier, but by age 30-31 I got a severe bacterial infection and never recovered. That alone did more damage to me than mercury and has caused even more suffering.

So I can imagine most people on here have their own story and it is not always such a cut and dry picture of "get amalgams out" detox for two years, get better. There is often more complications than this for some of us and often a long history of suffering.

I was not able to chelate in the way you have suggested. One DMSA capsule taken in isolation (50 mg) was enough to cause horrific symptoms and I could remain extremely ill for weeks from that alone. The every 4 hourly dosing kept things much more stable for me as it does for others on here. Though everybody is different and I'm sure some can use DMSA in that manner.

Cilantro is another one that some react very badly to (me included). I'm sure others do ok on it.

Anon, you are right about patience. I'm not sure if I will need all of 2 years to chelate, but I think I ought to commit myself to at least 6 months, see how I'm feeling. I'd be OK to check out the adrenal link but what I would really like is to hear some testimonials from people who have used things that have worked for them.

Bex, I think you are spot on with what's happening to me. I am glad I resisted the urge to eat sugar yesterday because it might have prevented me from taking note of the symptoms I was having and making connections. The symptoms I listed seem to be the typical ones I get from mercury, because they are the ones I got upon amalgam removal. I took a dose of 25mg each DMSA/ALA an hour ago and I'm already feeling a bit better -- more stable, less anxious, more motivated, more clear-headed. I think this is going to be rough on the adrenals again but it will be worth it in order to settle down. If I need a longer rest after this round then I will have one.

This combo at this dosage seemed to work OK before so I will stick to it. In my case it looks like the ALA stirs things up, but I need the extra help from the DMSA to pull it out of my system. The DMSA actually works better that way than anything else I've tried. Expensive or not, I'm sticking with it LOL. At this dosage it's not horribly costly yet.

What a roller-coaster ride all this is. Thanks very much for your help Bex. I suppose I'll have to start thinking about investing in Cutler's book at some point. I'm convinced now that I have mercury.

Linda.

Hi Linda, the fact you have been able to stablise those symptoms tells me that it's gotta be mercury (and maybe other metal) related. As awful as it is, it is at least "some" consolation that you are likely on the right road.

Maybe this is the way to keep doing it until you feel secure to up the dose a bit later on maybe. Maybe the ALA is not as stable as DMSA OR it's pulling mercury out of the organs/brain and needs DMSA to help keep a stronger grip on what's been pulled out.

Hope you can keep this up (financially as well), and keep us posted on how things go as time goes on. andy cutler's book is one of the best "mercury" related purchases I ever made, so hope you can get that at some stage. Though alot of it is over my head, there is enough that is very logical and helpful and is a real aid as you go through this. You may find yourself continually opening his book and re-reading over and over.

Not the most organised book, but content is excellent.

Thanks Bex, I'll keep going. I feel like I set myself back a bit, I'm struggling, but at least my sense of calm is back. The anxiety is a hard symptom to deal with isn't it. Well live and learn I guess.

Linda.