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Hi everyone,

This is my first post on this site. I had my amalgams removed several years ago by a dentist who wasn't very educated on mercury poisoning. Iv'e been chelating per Andy Cutler protocal for a little over a year know with slow but steady progress. My quesion is how do you know if the dentist really removed ALL of the amalgam in each tooth? Has anyone ever found out after having thier fillings removed that there was some still left behind, and just covered over with enamel or porcelain material ?

Thanks,
Roger

Hi Roger and welcome to the pleasuredome.

You will know if you still have amalgam in your mouth from the symptoms you get when you chelate. What will happen is that the chelator will pull huge amounts of amalgam from the mercury in your filling (as well as your body stores). It will pull LOTS of mercury out and your symptoms will be crazy/nightmare even at ultra low low doses.

What dosage are you at? How are your symptoms?

Well, I had my 12 amalgams out 22 years ago. I started chelating about a year and a half ago with DMSA..I started at 25mg every 4 hrs without a problem, then gradually built up to 100mg without any side effects..I really felt great. Then I added ALA at 12.mg evry 3 hrs for a few rounds, stiil felt great..went up to 25mg for several rounds..still felt really good, then all of a sudden all hell broke loose..muscle/joint pain,depression,anxiety,nightmares,weekness,brain fog..ect. I had to stop chelating all together for about 6 months. I just started to chelate again with DMSA only 12.5mg. I think what happened was after having my filling out for over 22 years the level of mercury in my body was fairly low and the DMSA cleared it out pretty quickly and I felt great, but when I added the ALA it started pulling mercury out of my brain way to fast and I just ended up with alot of mercury in my body again. But sometimes I still wonder if that dentist got all of it out. I have been trying to support my adrenals and thyroid before I start chelating again, this time I'll take it very slow with the ALA.

Thanks,
Roger

What a ‘mare!

Going ultra low dose is the way to go for you.

I started at 12.5 mg dmsa every 4 hours. Took a couple of painful rounds to figure out I needed to reduce my dose to 6mg and because I’m a fast metaboliser reduce the times down to every 3 hours.

ALA is taken every 3 hours, but because I’m a fast metaboliser I may have to dose at 2 or 2.5 hours when I get around to it. Only way to find out is try it and see. too early for me to try ALA.

When you retry ALA go ultra low dose and maybe reduce the dosing times down to 2 or 2.5 hours.

I believe what you experienced was rather a liberation of a large bacteria pocket. It happened to me too sometimes. At first I thought I had Lyme, because of the pains radiating into legs and arms, and the tingling, but it wasn't that, it cleared within days, and everything was well again. ALA can do that, because it goes everywhere, especially into cells and brain, where e.g. mycoplasma bacterias hide from immune system. I always feel better and better after a die-off. I use also various stuff to cleanup the tissues from the toxins and bacterias, like L-carnosine, molybdenum, pantothenic acid and soon to add more stuff. Things have definitely started going well for me (and the change has been fast too!), once I forgot about the mercury and started treating myself for bacterias and other pathogens.

hi roger : had the same experience with ala , it is more powerful than people think , if I use it in the future it will be every third or fourth round at a very low dose about 5 mg the stuff removes too much mercury at one time , some people can get away with more ,but for people like us we have to go very very slow , so you did pretty good on the dmsa alone , did it help you alot ?

Yeah, you have to be careful because you can definitely hit a storage of mercury (pocket). It happened to me often and sometimes I thought I was getting away with a pretty high dose and then I'd get hit.

Remember how the accummulation of mercury over the years one has amalgam, the stuff just builds up everywhere. Almost like nests of it. Amalgam removal is only the beginning.

E.g. like for me recently, going into a dental office just for other dental work (not amalgam related) has caused me to become poisoned by the mercury vapor already in there. I know these symptoms well. Im as sick as a dog and I regret going, it was just extra my body couldn't handle. I cannot even get DMSA, the stuff is too expensive.

So I may get ALA at some point when I can get it and see if I can use that. It's been about 2 months or so since the dental visit, so I should be getting near the stage where I can use it.

roger : how did you feel before starting any chelation ? you had mentioned that you had 12 amalgams removed 22 years prior to chelation , did you just let you body detox by its self ,and if so how did that work ,and how did you feel during that time , was there any progress ?

Bex
I'm no big fan of mercury pockets. Bacterias seem much more likely. You will have it extremely difficult to explain all those symptoms with mercury (there is still no evidence for that mercury causes any detox reactions, some may excrete mercury when a "detox reaction" happens, while others do not), while a Herxheimer reaction does it all nicely, including the release of endotoxins, and electrolyte imbalances. Remember also that ALA is especially good against intracellular invaders, like viruses and mycoplasma bacterias.

Did you also know that Lyme "detox" symptoms are pretty much similar (although usually more severe) to those caused by amalgam illness? Lyme treatment is also pretty much similar to the treatment of amalgam illness: e.g. anti-candida diet, and natural/synthetic antibiotics, like grapefruit seed extract. So the underlying cause must be similar too, bacterial and viral infections + co-infections and other parasites.

If it was all pathgoen related, I would not have taken years to excrete metals in the process. Antifungals and diet helped to a point, but did nothing to address the underlying storage of metals which I needed to get out and chelation was the only real way to achieve this. If it was just pathogens, then antifungals and diet would have been it for me, because I wouldn't have spent a load of money on DMSA to grab the metals and get them out if the antifungals were doing the job.

You can explain it all away if you wish as pathogens, but you do not speak for me or my past experiences. How do you know there is no evidence that mercury doesn't cause detox reactions? Have you read people's experiences on here where testing has been done before/ after chelation? We've had one just recently.

Good grief, it's over the internet what can happen during mercury healing crisis, it's in mercury amalgam books. Mercury causes horrific detox reactions and I went through hell on earth as that stuff was coming out of me.

The ADA also claim that there is no evidence mercury causes any problems at all....they too would deny mercury causes detox reactions, because in saying that, it would be admitting that mercury causes toxicity in the first place.

in order for the body to become toxic with mercury in the first place, which is often why pathogens flourish, there needs to be an opposite when one takes actions against the mercury, which is detox. Detox anything and it usually causes a worsening of symptoms. How can mercury be any different? It's even more lethal than just about any other toxin/metal. So it doesn't hurt whilst it goes in...and according to you, no evidence that it hurts on the way out? This to me makes no sense.

If you deny detox reactions? You might as well deny the toxicity of mercury whilst you're at it. Because mercury isn't water. Mercury is not a neutral substance. The stuff hurts and it hurts like crazy going in, it hurts like crazy coming out for many people.

Die off aint fun either, but it sure the heck isn't the only thing going on with people treating amalgam toxicity.

Not everybody has lyme Pgm and ALA might be effective against pathogens, but that does not explain everything or how people with amalgam poisoning, may not have recovered from antifungal aid, but rather from chelating instead. We see a few of those on the forums. Most of them by the way have been treating pathogens and finding "some" relief, but mercury elimination appears to be the main focus and the way some are reclaiming their health/lives.

to explain away detox or reactions from chelation as pathogen related and not much more, is denying almost completely the role mercury is playing or the fact that specific chelating agents that target mercury and/or lead are doing anything but treating pathogens. Sorry but this is misleading. Chelating agents are not direct antifungal agents, but metal chelating agents. They are what they are. If pathogen related conditions are improved at the sametime, great, but that is not what these agents are specifically targeted at.

Someone could also simply treat their pathogens in other ways without paying out a lot of money for chelating agents, when in reality they don't chelate anything, they just treat pathogens..?

Sorry, no offense, but there is no way I could put everybody's symptoms on here, detox or otherwise all down to pathogens. I know some may have more pathogen related problems than mercury, but others may have more mercury. Who are we to deny that because our experience may have been otherwise?

I feel both pathogens and mercury are capable of causing symptoms in both toxicity and symptoms during elimination/mobilisation.

Ermmmm, what on earth are you talking about?

What are you doing here?

Have you been hijacked too?

Yeah, it's probably safe to say there is plenty of evidence that mercury causes plenty of detox reactions. Considering the fact that doctors do study it and track the detox reactions...

but, there isn't any evidence that chelation pulls mercury out from amalgams causing nightmarish symptoms. I don't know where people get that idea. there is plenty of evidence it simply isn't true. people with amalgams get chelated every day... for mercury.. for cadmium... for lead... and they all get better not worse from chelating.

in fact, I feel pretty good after chelating for about a year with 5 amalgams still in... maybe 6... i have to look in there and count.

That being said, I find it difficult to imagine that mercury residue under composites could cause major issues while chelating. Bacteria under mercury fillings with composites over them can be problematic however.

If you're using only an oral chelator liike dmsa, a big portion of it gets used up in your liver anyway, which will hold onto a lot of toxins. I'd venture it's quite doubtful much of it ever reaches the mercury in the amalgams in your mouth. There's a lot of argument about it of course.

and then, there;s the fact that the first few weeks of chelating may often do nothing or not much... and then all of a sudden stuff starts realeasing. It could be anything. You might want to get tested for lead for instance. Dmsa binds better to lead than mercury. A lot of people have problems with lead (or copper, aluminum, tin) and aren't aware of it. The blood tests are kind of expensive but worth it.

After 22 years your body would have eliminated much of the mercury on it's own. but you get a new breathful daily no matter what. over 40 tons of mercury (that's old data btw) are released into the environment every year by industry and fossil fuel power plants. They are building a new coal generated power plant in China every week so that's sure to give us all a health boost too.

Plan on some form of chelation forever I guess. I like cilantro in that respect.

mercury pockets?
never heard this expression,it's a good description though
I would like to describe a strange sensation that I experienced on 2 occasions that I believe to be some kind of release/disturbance of mercury...
once a few days ago and another time last November,exactly 7 years on from receiving my last vaccination...
I experienced the jabbing pain in my upper left shoulder,exactly in the site of the vaccine.
The pain felt like I had just got the shot again.
The vaccine was the furthest thing from my mind when this happened so it's not like I was thinking of it.I had actually forgotten about it.
I am not sure if thimerisol however was used in the vaccine,it was a meningitis one.I have since tried to find out,but could not get a straight answer from any dr.
I had that vaccine in college at age 21 and have never fully regained my health since.Had a bad reaction to it,took 2 months of college and have never been the same since.
My guess is there was thimerisol in that vaccine or something else in it made me ill.

Thanks for the input everyone, I appreciate it.

After I had my fillings out 22 years ago I didn't do anything at all up until 2 years ago when I first started reading about chelation.

During that time I slowly improved but I still had many symptoms...although I do believe most of the mercury in my body came out during that time, I know I still had alot of it stored in my brain.

As if it wasn't bad enough I had 12 fillings, my dentist told me while he was removing my fillings that whoever put my fillings in didn't know what he was doing. He said he couldn't believe how much mercury was in them.

So at this point after not chelating for the past 10 months, I just started again using very low doses of ALA and DMSA.
I'm going to chelate with DMSA 10mg, ALA 2.5mg every 2 hours for 3 days on 4 days off.

I started doing this 2 days ago, even though the ALA is very low at 2.5mg I could feel it right away (in a good way). So I plan on taking nice and slow to start, may even use the ALA every other round just to be on the safe side, until I feel as though I can start increasing the dose.

Thanks again all!

Roger

Sunshine, Bex.
Heh, I have not been hijacked.. There is no solid evidence for that detox reactions are caused by mercury. You might think that using DMSA and because it helps that it proves that you're chelating away mercury. This is not necessarily so. DMSA, like any other chelator has also lots of other properties, like being anti-pathogenic (has anti-viral and anti-bacterial properties) and chelating also acetaldehyde.

Some proof that you can get well in various ways, is that some have gotten well on protocols including anti-biotics as the major component (those that pass blood-brain barrier). I do not recommend these, as the detox reactions can be very severe, and you also risk killing beneficial bacterias.

And yes, not everyone here has Lyme, that is certain, and I didn't claim that either. But everyone has Lyme-like detox reactions, and this points out to some OTHER bacterias, most likely at least mycoplasma. Anti-fungals alone are not the way to treat amalgam-illness, if bacterias are the main concern, so I'm not surprised that everyone doesn't get cured on anti-fungals alone.

Those who can't stand cysteine (which is dense in sulfur), or sulfur rich foods, investigate rather the possibility that your bacterias in bowels are NOT ok, and that this needs to be addressed.

Ray Saarela on the amalgam research list
http://dfn-listserv.fzk.de/archives/amalgam.html
(see especially the messages from 1998-2001),
thinks that this is because of the bacterias that also feed on chelators such as ALA and DMPS, and produce toxic H2S, that makes you feel sick as a dog.

What does mercury then cause? Well the only thing that appears sure knowledge is that it causes pathological changes in immune system, letting the pathogens accumulate over the years in our bodies, with emphasis on intracellular invaders. You may or may not have accumulated more mercury in body, but everyone is still sick even if body mercury levels are low.

Hope this helped someone.