|
0 registered members (),
1,449
guests, and 7
spiders. |
|
Key:
Admin,
Global Mod,
Mod
|
|
|
S |
M |
T |
W |
T |
F |
S |
|
|
|
|
1
|
2
|
3
|
4
|
|
5
|
6
|
7
|
8
|
9
|
10
|
11
|
|
12
|
13
|
14
|
15
|
16
|
17
|
18
|
|
19
|
20
|
21
|
22
|
23
|
24
|
25
|
|
26
|
27
|
28
|
29
|
30
|
31
|
|
|
 Only The Best Herbs!
Your best source of world-class herbal information! More... |
 #1 Book We've Found!
"Silver" fillings, mercury detox, & much more. More... |
 For Mercury Detox
Prevent mercury reabsorption in the colon during detox. More... |
 Softcover & Kindle
Excellent resource for mercury detox. More... |
 For Mercury Chelation
For calcium chelation and heart health. More... |
 Must for Every Parent
The most complete vaccine info on the planet. More... |
 Finally.
Relief! More... |
 Dr. Sherri Tenpenny
Get the info you need to protect yourself. More... |
 What everyone's talking about!
Safe, powerful, timely! More... |
 There is a difference!
A powerful brain antioxidant for use during Hg detox. More... |
 This changed my life!
This book convinced me remove my fillings. More... |
 This is what we use!
The only multi where you feel the difference. More... |
 Hair Tests Explained!
Discover hidden toxicities, easily. More... |
Have Racing Thoughts?
Many use GABA for anxiety and better sleep. More... |
 Help Them!
Natural health for pets. More... |
 The Bible We Use!
King James with study notes by Bullinger. More... |
The Bible We Use!
King James with study notes by Bullinger. More... |
 Food Additives
Protect your family from toxic food! More... |
|
|
|
|
The Coolest thing in Genetics
#45703
12/02/08 02:37 AM
12/02/08 02:37 AM
|
OP
Master Elite Member
|
Joined: Mar 2008
Posts: 1,315
|
|
No big mystery: RECOMBINATION is the coolest thing in genetics. The automated shuffling of DNA codes is something that is very important, and is, when understood, incompatible with evolutionism. Check this out. If mutations played a key function in evolution, organisms with RNA genomes, which show a higher mutation frequency than DNA genomes, would have evolved into higher organisms much faster than those with DNA genomes, but this is not the case. This quote isn't taken out-of-context. Indeed, what context can be imagined in which this quotation would say anything substantially different than what it so clearly says? This is what happens on the rare occasions when, commendably enough, evolutionist biologists attempt to speak honestly about recombination. I plan to read more of this, especially if I can find a friendlier copy. It contains more than one gem, and more than one important fact. Recombination has been discussed before in a handful of threads, so it's hard to decide whether to post links to the other discussions, or copy & paste content into this thread. I don't intend to type it all over again. Either way, I plan to follow up with more critical information.
Dark Matter + Dark Energy = Dark Truth"We find that such evidence demonstrates that the ID argument is dependent upon setting a scientifically unreasonable burden of proof for the theory of evolution." - Judge Jones Kitzmiller case http://www.talkreason.org/articles/Falsify.cfm"To Compel A Man To Furnish Funds For The Propagation Of Ideas He Disbelieves And Abhors Is Sinful And Tyrannical." - Thomas Jefferson "And can the liberties of a nation be thought secure when we have removed their only firm basis, a conviction in the minds of the people that these liberties are the gift of God? That they are not to be violated but with his wrath?" - Thomas Jefferson
|
|
|
Re: The Coolest thing in Genetics
[Re: CTD]
#45705
12/02/08 04:20 AM
12/02/08 04:20 AM
|
OP
Master Elite Member
|
Joined: Mar 2008
Posts: 1,315
|
|
I posted some good links on the subject here. And epigenetics is pretty cool too. Naturally it's intertwined with recombination, and the two can't practically be separated. (The links are down a ways, near the end of the post.)
Dark Matter + Dark Energy = Dark Truth"We find that such evidence demonstrates that the ID argument is dependent upon setting a scientifically unreasonable burden of proof for the theory of evolution." - Judge Jones Kitzmiller case http://www.talkreason.org/articles/Falsify.cfm"To Compel A Man To Furnish Funds For The Propagation Of Ideas He Disbelieves And Abhors Is Sinful And Tyrannical." - Thomas Jefferson "And can the liberties of a nation be thought secure when we have removed their only firm basis, a conviction in the minds of the people that these liberties are the gift of God? That they are not to be violated but with his wrath?" - Thomas Jefferson
|
|
|
Re: The Coolest thing in Genetics
[Re: CTD]
#45706
12/02/08 04:41 AM
12/02/08 04:41 AM
|
OP
Master Elite Member
|
Joined: Mar 2008
Posts: 1,315
|
|
For those who don't have much time to spare, there is one simple shortcut which will help one start to understand the relative magnitudes & speeds of recombination vs. mutation.
Look at a large family. Note the differences between siblings. Far less than one per cent of these differences are due to mutation. The differences you see (a.k.a. variety) are overwhelmingly the result of recombination.
May not sound like a big deal, but it's more than enough to shut down any version of evolutionism I've ever encountered. The environment is supposed to 'favour' this or that, say tallness for example. Will tallness show up as a result of recombination? You bet! And quickly. Will it show up as a result of mutation? It could. How many generations are you prepared to wait? How many is the environment going to wait?
It's not hard at all to see that even if one imagines beneficial mutations, they can't get any traction, and the race is over before they even reach the starting gate.
Now factor in gene expression: the capacity for coded information to lie dormant for centuries just waiting until it's needed. Then "whoop there it is!" How can mutation compete with that? No way! Lifeforms adapt to their environments by design. These are all things which have been observed, and they handily eliminate the need for & possibility of unobserved mythological conceptions.
Note also that in purebred animals, there is much less variety. Much of the information has been bred out of these creatures, which is why they all look alike and tend to be vulnerable to the same diseases. Inbreeding also diminishes genetic information.
It's not hard at all to see why evolutionists view(ed) genetics as the antithesis of Darwinism. It's a xor deal, unless you can buy Hegel's nonsense, and that obviously takes effort and intent to deceive oneself.
Edit:
One should be aware when reading the hype, that most of the time, the results of recombination and gene expression are reported as "mutations". If you have time, look into some of these for yourself & be prepared to laugh. You'll even see cases where highly "educated" biologists get it totally wrong - which just shows the extent to which the truth of recombination is kept out of their college courses. You will see it, and you will know it; it doesn't take all that much education - just factual, accurate, simple knowledge. *** This summary was originally posted here. Anyhow, I figured I should provide something beyond links, so now I have.
Dark Matter + Dark Energy = Dark Truth"We find that such evidence demonstrates that the ID argument is dependent upon setting a scientifically unreasonable burden of proof for the theory of evolution." - Judge Jones Kitzmiller case http://www.talkreason.org/articles/Falsify.cfm"To Compel A Man To Furnish Funds For The Propagation Of Ideas He Disbelieves And Abhors Is Sinful And Tyrannical." - Thomas Jefferson "And can the liberties of a nation be thought secure when we have removed their only firm basis, a conviction in the minds of the people that these liberties are the gift of God? That they are not to be violated but with his wrath?" - Thomas Jefferson
|
|
|
Re: The Coolest thing in Genetics
[Re: CTD]
#53132
09/12/09 04:17 AM
09/12/09 04:17 AM
|
OP
Master Elite Member
|
Joined: Mar 2008
Posts: 1,315
|
|
Evolutionists are at a loss for effective propaganda when it comes to recombination. Responses vary widely, and will continue to vary until dogma can be confidently established. Here's what you can expect to see: 1.) Denial - the old stand-by. 2.) Classify recombination as "mutation", as if folks can't tell the difference. 3.) Pretend it fits in just fine with evostories - bluffing is another stand-by. 4.) Downplay recombination. The 4th one is the one my evidence primarily counters in this post. http://users.rcn.com/jkimball.ma.ultranet/BiologyPages/A/Avery.htmlBacteria have no sexual reproduction in the sense that eukaryotes do. The have
* no alternation of diploid and haploid generations
* no gametes
* no meiosis
But the essence of sex is genetic recombination, and bacteria do have three mechanisms to accomplish that:
* transformation
* conjugation
* transduction The downplay game claims the only recombination that ever takes place is when sperm and egg unite. Clearly this is false. Biologists have known better for several decades. As we see, even among single-celled bacteria there are three distinct types of recombination. Those who like solving puzzles are invited to follow the link and read the section on "transformation". See if you spot anything that prevents the evostory, as we know it, from taking place. I intend to post "the answer" in a few days, or a week, or so. Someone please remind me if I don't.
Dark Matter + Dark Energy = Dark Truth"We find that such evidence demonstrates that the ID argument is dependent upon setting a scientifically unreasonable burden of proof for the theory of evolution." - Judge Jones Kitzmiller case http://www.talkreason.org/articles/Falsify.cfm"To Compel A Man To Furnish Funds For The Propagation Of Ideas He Disbelieves And Abhors Is Sinful And Tyrannical." - Thomas Jefferson "And can the liberties of a nation be thought secure when we have removed their only firm basis, a conviction in the minds of the people that these liberties are the gift of God? That they are not to be violated but with his wrath?" - Thomas Jefferson
|
|
|
Re: The Coolest thing in Genetics
[Re: CTD]
#53408
09/25/09 11:02 PM
09/25/09 11:02 PM
|
OP
Master Elite Member
|
Joined: Mar 2008
Posts: 1,315
|
|
Okay, I suppose it's about time to explain.
The role of the selection goddess of death is critical in evolutionism. She's the one tasked with eliminating the unfit. When she spots a bad mutation, Blam! Or so they'd have us think.
The link explains how bacteria go about reclaiming DNA from the environment, often from dead bacteria. This makes the selection goddess' job impossible. She cannot permanently eliminate unfit traits if they're being recycled. She's just spinning her wheels going around killing things she doesn't like; future generations of bacteria will still have access to the DNA.
Dark Matter + Dark Energy = Dark Truth"We find that such evidence demonstrates that the ID argument is dependent upon setting a scientifically unreasonable burden of proof for the theory of evolution." - Judge Jones Kitzmiller case http://www.talkreason.org/articles/Falsify.cfm"To Compel A Man To Furnish Funds For The Propagation Of Ideas He Disbelieves And Abhors Is Sinful And Tyrannical." - Thomas Jefferson "And can the liberties of a nation be thought secure when we have removed their only firm basis, a conviction in the minds of the people that these liberties are the gift of God? That they are not to be violated but with his wrath?" - Thomas Jefferson
|
|
|
Re: The Coolest thing in Genetics
[Re: CTD]
#57110
05/15/10 01:33 AM
05/15/10 01:33 AM
|
OP
Master Elite Member
|
Joined: Mar 2008
Posts: 1,315
|
|
Seeing as we have no "Theory of Evolution" to reference, I think strict predictions are out of the question. However, we may readily enough survey expectations. Evolutionists have historically expected simplicity at the cellular level, and they continue to do so. Even to this day many of them routinely dismiss the majority of DNA as "junk" and employ their familiar argument-from-ignorance in support of the assumption. Creationists, on the other hand, have not been difficult to read. Creationism expects complexity and wonders. What is found? "Intricate Toiling" Washington Post Article, 2007 The first concerted effort to understand all the inner workings of the DNA molecule is overturning a host of long-held assumptions about the nature of genes and their role in human health and evolution, scientists reported yesterday.
The new perspective reveals DNA to be not just a string of biological code but a dauntingly complex operating system that processes many more kinds of information than previously appreciated. Mmm hmm... Overturning assumptions, long-held assumptions at that. What manner of science proceeds from assumption in the first place? An operating system? Oh that's gotta hurt. ...Well, for those who care and know what an operating system is. Sure puts the smackdown on the "DNA isn't a code - that's just a weak analogy" crowd. The findings, from a project involving hundreds of scientists in 11 countries and detailed in 29 papers being published today, confirm growing suspicions that the stretches of "junk DNA" flanking hardworking genes are not junk at all. But the study goes further, indicating for the first time that the vast majority of the 3 billion "letters" of the human genetic code are busily toiling at an array of previously invisible tasks. Oh somebody stop 'em! Don't be intimidated, peer-reviewers, do your job and protect the paradigm. Hurry hurry hurry! The new work also overturns the conventional notion that genes are discrete packets of information arranged like beads on a thread of DNA. Instead, many genes overlap one another and share stretches of molecular code. As with phone lines that carry many voices at once, that arrangement has prompted the evolution of complex switching, splicing and silencing mechanisms -- mostly located between genes -- to sort out the interwoven messages. Poor selection goddess. Imagine how confused she must be! First she was tasked with selecting unfit individuals; then populations; then genes. Now this! What's the hag to do? The new picture of the inner workings of DNA probably will require some rethinking in the search for genetic patterns that dispose people to diseases such as diabetes, cancer and heart disease, the scientists said, but ultimately the findings are likely to speed the development of ways to prevent and treat a variety of illnesses.
...
Complicating the picture, it turns out that genes and the DNA sequences that regulate their activity are often far apart along the six-foot-long strands of DNA intricately packaged inside each cell. How they communicate is still largely a mystery. Ah-ha! Well, so long as there's a mystery; so long as anything's unknown, they'll cling to their evolution-of-the-gaps stories. I'm waiting to see how they fill this one in with some "evolution did it" twists. Altogether, the new project shows that the simple sequence of DNA letters revealed to great fanfare by the $3 billion Human Genome Project in 2003 was but a skeletal version of the human construction manual. It is the alphabet, but not much more, for a syntactically complicated language of life that scientists are just now beginning to learn. That was 2007. Although the learning process is still just barely beginning, it is beginning. Science Daily, May 2010In a paper published on May 6 in the journal Nature entitled "Deciphering the Splicing Code," a research team led by Professors Brendan Frey and Benjamin Blencowe of the University of Toronto describes how a hidden code within DNA explains one of the central mysteries of genetic research -- namely how a limited number of human genes can produce a vastly greater number of genetic messages. The discovery bridges a decade-old gap between our understanding of the genome and the activity of complex processes within cells, and could one day help predict or prevent diseases such as cancers and neurodegenerative disorders. Somebody's not too keen on design, and it shows. How can my telephone produce so many different sounds with only one type of speaker? When the human genome was fully sequenced in 2004, approximately 20,000 genes were found. However, it was discovered that living cells use those genes to generate a much richer and more dynamic source of instructions, consisting of hundreds of thousands of genetic messages that direct most cellular activities. Frey, who has appointments in Engineering and Medicine, likens this discovery to "hearing a full orchestra playing behind a locked door, and then when you pry the door open, you discover only three or four musicians generating all that music." Enough with the poor analogy. What's new? To figure out how living cells generate vast diversity in their genetic information, Frey and postdoctoral fellow Yoseph Barash developed a new computer-assisted biological analysis method that finds 'codewords' hidden within the genome that constitute what is referred to as a 'splicing code'. This code contains the biological rules that are used to govern how separate parts of a genetic message copied from a gene can be spliced together in different ways to produce different genetic messages (messenger RNAs). "For example, three neurexin genes can generate over 3,000 genetic messages that help control the wiring of the brain," says Frey. Kinda like words? We only use a few hundred words in typical, everyday speech. Words composed of letters. Words strung together to mean - oh! Meaning! That's the hangup. Meaningful information requires an intelligent source. No wonder we don't see the best analogy. I like this work, but reportingwise, they did better a while back on a related issue. http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2007/11/071114151513.htm"It's clear that humans are very different from chimpanzees on several levels, but we wanted to find out if it could be the splicing process that accounts for some of these fundamental differences," says Blencowe, a professor with the Banting and Best Department of Medical Research and Department of Molecular Genetics.
"The surprising thing we found was that six to eight per cent of the alternative splicing events we looked at were showing differences, which is quite significant. And those genes that showed differences in splicing are associated with a range of important processes, including susceptibility to certain diseases." So the vocabulary used by the human DNA differs significantly from the vocabulary used by the chimp DNA, in other words. This research is good stuff - at least from my perspective. I do wish they'd give up their cherished assumptions. It'd make things easier to understand. I suspect when they work, they employ better analogies than when they publish. On the bright side, I see a few indications that some are willing to give up cherished assumptions when reality is staring them directly in the face. ...Well, provided they see a way to twist things enough to maintain their most sacred assumption, that is. You know, the one they cannot question without "committing professional suicide". 'Member that one?
Dark Matter + Dark Energy = Dark Truth"We find that such evidence demonstrates that the ID argument is dependent upon setting a scientifically unreasonable burden of proof for the theory of evolution." - Judge Jones Kitzmiller case http://www.talkreason.org/articles/Falsify.cfm"To Compel A Man To Furnish Funds For The Propagation Of Ideas He Disbelieves And Abhors Is Sinful And Tyrannical." - Thomas Jefferson "And can the liberties of a nation be thought secure when we have removed their only firm basis, a conviction in the minds of the people that these liberties are the gift of God? That they are not to be violated but with his wrath?" - Thomas Jefferson
|
|
|
My Mistake
[Re: CTD]
#62979
06/09/11 01:41 AM
06/09/11 01:41 AM
|
OP
Master Elite Member
|
Joined: Mar 2008
Posts: 1,315
|
|
I just searched, and as best I can determine I've never shared this article here: http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2007/06/070620154911.htmI'm sorry for my negligence. It really says a lot about more than one issue. I may return to comment, but you should be able to enjoy it at least a little without my assistance, I think. They have another sister piece as well. http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2007/03/070309103157.htm
Dark Matter + Dark Energy = Dark Truth"We find that such evidence demonstrates that the ID argument is dependent upon setting a scientifically unreasonable burden of proof for the theory of evolution." - Judge Jones Kitzmiller case http://www.talkreason.org/articles/Falsify.cfm"To Compel A Man To Furnish Funds For The Propagation Of Ideas He Disbelieves And Abhors Is Sinful And Tyrannical." - Thomas Jefferson "And can the liberties of a nation be thought secure when we have removed their only firm basis, a conviction in the minds of the people that these liberties are the gift of God? That they are not to be violated but with his wrath?" - Thomas Jefferson
|
|
|
|
Circle-of-Life Forums - Welcome
