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Re: A More Noble Endeavor
#36171
06/24/08 08:33 AM
06/24/08 08:33 AM
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LinearAQ...
You really crack me up. You seem so caught up with this business of understanding the difference between law, statute, and ordinance.
Do you really think I don't know you're real motives for your "interest"? You can read my mind now or did God reveal my exact motive to you during your time in prayer? Sorry for the sarcasm but it seemed like it was time for a little tit-for-tat. My motives for this are that you claim to have the only valid interpretation of the words in the Bible and you claim that certain parts should be followed exactly and others should not. I was merely asking what you used as your guide to determine which rules to enforce (within your own life...that is) and which can be tossed aside. If you're truly interested in knowing the Bible, then study it. I'll tell you a little more about how in a minute. Another word from God? I doubt it since I have studied the Bible. Maybe you are not in contact with the right spirit? I use Strongs, and Interlinear Bible, and the King James.
For help on your first time through the good Book, I would suggest the Bullinger Companion Bible.
That's how. Amazingly, despite my claims to the contrary, your source is telling you that I have not looked at the Bible. However, let's look at Strong's definition of the Greek for the word "ordinance" from 1 Cor 11:2 in the King James. 3862 // paradosiv // paradosis // par-ad'-os-is //
from 3860 ; TDNT - 2:172,166; n f
AV - tradition 12, ordinance 1; 13
1) giving up, giving over 1a) the act of giving up 1b) the surrender of cities 2) a giving over which is done by word of mouth or in writing, i.e. tradition by instruction, narrative, precept, etc. 2a) objectively, that which is delivered, the substance of a teaching 2b) of the body of precepts, esp. ritual, which in the opinion of the later Jews were orally delivered by Moses and orally transmitted in unbroken succession to subsequent generations, which precepts, both illustrating and expanding the written law, as they did were to be obeyed with equal reverence I think we can throw out 1, 1a, and 1b. If you disagree please step in here. The question is, which of the other definitions is the right one for this particular passage. As you can tell, I ruled out 1, 1a, and 1b as inapplicable based on the context in which the word was placed. The King James translators also believed those 3 definitions to be inapplicable since they translated the Greek words meaning "to give over" into "ordinance". The women in the church that first used the King James Bible always wore a veil when in the congregation of the church. It is only relatively recently that the Anglican church congregation has parted with this tradition. They also now claim that homosexuality is not a sin. Back to the questions at hand: How did you determine that this "ordinance" was really just a tradition with a limited societal/time applicability since Strong's doesn't really clear things up? Once you determined that the rule was merely a tradition, how did you determine that it was no longer applicable. This is especially true since Christians are to be in the world but not of the world. How do you know that you are not letting the world unduly influence your opinion on this passage (as you believe science has done to me with regard to Genesis)? You're staring so intently at an ordinance that you're missing the nature of the law. Unfortunately, there is so much background information missing that you are not even asking the right questions. Then enlighten me instead of criticizing my ignorance. My question to you is: Why do you care about the errors of Christians? Is it to ease your own conscience, or will you prove a more noble endeavor? Again with the intimation that I am not a Christian. I guess you have more insight into my inner nature than I do myself. I believe I am a Christian but perhaps I am deluding myself that the requirements for being saved were all in Romans. My concern with the opinions of certain Christian sects is that those sects are trying to influence the education of my grandchildren. They are trying to change the laws so that their version of the natural history of this planet becomes the reigning paradigm despite mounds of evidence contradicting that version. What next? Repeal the First Amendment and establish a state religion? Maybe in the name of "free speech" we should teach alternatives to the Germ Theory of disease or the atomic theory of matter or alternatives to history teaching that the Nazi's attempted to exterminate the Jews. That, in my opinion, is the more noble endeavor, to teach our children that reason and evidence should be used in determining what you believe. If you believe that I am trying to ease my conscience then you will have to go back to your source to find out what I am easing my conscience about, since I don't have any idea.
A faith that connot survive collision with the truth is not worth many regrets. -- Arthur C. Clarke
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Entire Thread
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Most People Don't Want The Truth...
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Russ
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06/02/08 05:08 AM
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Re: Most People Don't Want The Truth...
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Kitsune
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06/02/08 06:17 AM
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Re: Most People Don't Want The Truth...
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Russ
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06/02/08 07:39 AM
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Re: Most People Don't Want The Truth...
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SoSick
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06/02/08 02:53 PM
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Re: Most People Don't Want The Truth...
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Kitsune
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06/02/08 04:50 PM
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Motives
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Russ
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06/02/08 06:31 PM
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Re: Motives
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Kitsune
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06/02/08 07:18 PM
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Fundamentals
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Russ
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06/02/08 11:27 PM
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Fundamental misunderstandings are not truths
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RAZD
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06/03/08 03:18 AM
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Cognitive Dissonance
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Russ
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06/03/08 05:23 AM
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Re: Cognitive Dissonance
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Pwcca
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06/03/08 07:03 AM
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Re: Cognitive Dissonance
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Bex
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06/03/08 07:46 AM
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Re: Cognitive Dissonance
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Bex
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06/03/08 07:17 AM
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Re: Cognitive Dissonance & Delusion vs evidence and objective reality
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RAZD
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06/03/08 11:42 PM
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Re: Cognitive Dissonance & Delusion vs evidence and objective reality
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CTD
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06/04/08 04:15 AM
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Re: Cognitive Dissonance & Delusion vs evidence and objective reality
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RAZD
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06/05/08 01:40 AM
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Evoquests ain't my problem
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CTD
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06/06/08 06:03 AM
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The shuck and jive ...
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RAZD
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06/07/08 07:17 AM
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Re: The shuck and jive ...
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CTD
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06/07/08 12:39 PM
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The shuck and jive continues ... you still can't do it ...
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RAZD
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06/08/08 12:04 AM
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Evidence
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Kitsune
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06/08/08 06:27 AM
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The shuck and jive continues
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CTD
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06/08/08 12:56 PM
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enough?
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RAZD
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06/08/08 10:29 PM
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Symmetry
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Russ
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06/09/08 05:17 AM
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Re: Symmetry
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Russ
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06/09/08 06:20 AM
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Re: enough?
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CTD
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06/10/08 06:16 AM
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Re: The shuck and jive ...
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CTD
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06/25/08 04:48 AM
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Re: The shuck and jive ...
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RAZD
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06/26/08 12:47 AM
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Re: The shuck and jive ...
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CTD
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06/26/08 02:09 AM
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maybe I'm from missouri, and maybe not -- but you need to show me
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RAZD
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06/26/08 02:34 AM
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Re: maybe I'm from missouri, and maybe not -- but you need to show me
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Russ
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07/10/08 11:04 PM
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Re: maybe I'm from missouri, and maybe not -- but you need to show me
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RAZD
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07/11/08 12:34 AM
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Re: Fundamentals
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Pwcca
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06/03/08 07:17 AM
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Discovering the Conspirators
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Russ
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06/04/08 07:04 AM
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Re: Discovering the Conspirators
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Kitsune
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06/04/08 07:25 PM
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Re: Discovering the Conspirators
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Bex
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06/06/08 05:10 AM
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Re: Discovering the Conspirators
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Kitsune
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06/06/08 07:50 PM
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Re: Discovering the Conspirators
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Bex
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06/07/08 03:47 AM
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Re: Discovering the Conspirators
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Kitsune
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06/07/08 06:13 AM
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Re: Discovering the Conspirators
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Bex
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06/07/08 06:49 AM
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A question for creationists
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RAZD
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06/07/08 07:34 AM
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Re: A question for creationists
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Bex
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06/07/08 08:15 AM
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Re: A question for creationists
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RAZD
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06/07/08 07:33 PM
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Re: A question for creationists
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CTD
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06/07/08 08:35 PM
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Piece of cake
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CTD
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06/07/08 10:16 PM
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Re: Piece of cake, Piece of work.
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RAZD
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06/08/08 07:27 PM
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Piece of work, Piece of cake.
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CTD
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06/09/08 09:10 AM
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Re: Piece of work, Piece of cake.
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RAZD
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06/09/08 10:18 PM
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Re: Piece of work, Piece of cake.
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CTD
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06/10/08 02:01 AM
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Re: Piece of work, Piece of cake.
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Kitsune
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06/10/08 08:15 AM
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Re: Piece of work, Piece of cake.
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CTD
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06/10/08 11:48 AM
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Slander vs Reality
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RAZD
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06/15/08 04:20 PM
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Re: Slander vs Reality
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CTD
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06/16/08 01:16 PM
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Re: Slander vs Reality
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RAZD
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06/17/08 05:14 AM
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Re: Slander vs Reality
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CTD
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06/18/08 03:28 AM
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Re: Slander vs Reality
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RAZD
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06/19/08 12:07 AM
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Re: Discovering the Conspirators
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Kitsune
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06/07/08 09:55 AM
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Re: Discovering the Conspirators
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Bex
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06/07/08 10:22 PM
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Re: Discovering the Conspirators
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CTD
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06/07/08 11:05 PM
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Re: Yahya yadda yadda
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Kitsune
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06/07/08 09:44 PM
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Re: Yahya yadda yadda
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Bex
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06/08/08 06:18 AM
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Re: Yahya yadda yadda
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Kitsune
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06/08/08 05:58 PM
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Re: Yahya yadda yadda
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Kitsune
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06/08/08 07:24 PM
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Bias assumptions = bias interpretations = bias "evidence"
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Bex
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06/09/08 12:00 PM
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Re: Bias assumptions = bias interpretations = bias "evidence"
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Kitsune
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06/09/08 02:54 PM
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Re: Discovering the Conspirators
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LinearAq
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06/09/08 12:24 PM
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Re: Discovering the Conspirators
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Kitsune
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06/09/08 01:22 PM
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Re: Discovering the Conspirators
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Bex
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06/10/08 03:34 AM
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Re: Following Biblical instructions
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Kitsune
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06/10/08 08:25 AM
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Re: Following Biblical instructions
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CTD
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06/10/08 11:20 AM
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Re: Following Biblical instructions
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LinearAq
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06/10/08 02:29 PM
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Re: Following Biblical instructions
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CTD
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06/10/08 03:44 PM
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Re: Following Biblical instructions
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Kitsune
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06/10/08 03:55 PM
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Re: Following Biblical instructions
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CTD
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06/10/08 05:27 PM
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Learning How To Learn (Training Wheels for Linda and Linear)
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Russ
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06/10/08 09:25 PM
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Training Wheels for Linda and Linear
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Russ
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06/10/08 09:41 PM
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Training Wheels for Linda and Linear
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Russ
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06/10/08 10:18 PM
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Re: Training Wheels for Linda and Linear
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Pwcca
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06/10/08 10:48 PM
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My Message To Defenders of Logic and Reason
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Russ
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06/10/08 10:52 PM
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Re: My Message To Defenders of Logic and Reason
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Bex
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06/11/08 03:25 AM
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Re: My Message To Defenders of Logic and Reason
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CTD
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06/11/08 05:00 AM
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We're Not at War Here, Folks
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Pwcca
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06/11/08 01:52 PM
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We're at War Here, Folks
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CTD
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06/12/08 02:14 AM
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Re: We're at War Here, Folks
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Bex
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06/12/08 03:35 AM
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Re: We're at War Here, Folks
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LinearAq
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06/12/08 02:45 PM
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Evolutionists All Caught Up About Head Scarves
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Russ
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06/11/08 05:44 AM
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One More Thing...
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Russ
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06/11/08 06:07 AM
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Re: Evolutionists All Caught Up About Head Scarves
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Pwcca
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06/11/08 01:38 PM
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Re: Evolutionists All Caught Up About Head Scarves
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Kitsune
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06/11/08 01:39 PM
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Re: Evolutionists All Caught Up About Head Scarves
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LinearAq
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06/11/08 01:42 PM
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Re: Evolutionists All Caught Up About Head Scarves
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Pwcca
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06/11/08 02:12 PM
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Re: Evolutionists All Caught Up About Head Scarves
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Kitsune
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06/11/08 02:52 PM
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Re: Evolutionists All Caught Up About Head Scarves
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CTD
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06/12/08 05:18 AM
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Biblical "law"
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Kitsune
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06/12/08 02:31 PM
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Re: Biblical "law"
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Kitsune
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06/12/08 06:28 PM
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Re: Biblical "law"
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Pwcca
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06/12/08 08:08 PM
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Re: Biblical "law"
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LinearAq
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06/12/08 09:06 PM
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Re: Biblical "law"
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Kitsune
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06/12/08 10:12 PM
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Hypocrisy
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Russ
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06/16/08 02:27 AM
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Re: Hypocrisy
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Russ
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06/16/08 02:58 AM
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Bible study indeed
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LinearAq
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06/17/08 03:00 PM
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A More Noble Endeavor
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Russ
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06/24/08 05:47 AM
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Re: A More Noble Endeavor
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Kitsune
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06/24/08 06:16 AM
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Re: A More Noble Endeavor
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LinearAq
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06/24/08 12:33 PM
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Re: Hypocrisy
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Kitsune
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06/16/08 06:11 PM
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Re: Seeking the truth
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Kitsune
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06/16/08 07:31 PM
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Re: Seeking the truth
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Kitsune
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06/16/08 07:48 PM
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Re: Hypocrisy
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Russ
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06/17/08 02:24 AM
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Re: Hypocrisy
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Russ
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06/17/08 02:30 AM
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Re: Hypocrisy
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RAZD
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06/17/08 04:07 AM
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Re: Hypocrisy
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Kitsune
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06/17/08 06:36 AM
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Re: Hypocrisy
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Pwcca
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06/17/08 08:02 AM
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Re: Evolutionists All Caught Up About Head Scarves
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LinearAq
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06/12/08 03:45 PM
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Re: Evolutionists All Caught Up About Head Scarves
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Laura Clement
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06/12/08 04:35 PM
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The War Against Reality
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RAZD
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06/15/08 01:43 PM
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Re: Training Wheels for Linda and Linear
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Pwcca
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06/10/08 10:38 PM
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Re: Following Biblical instructions
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Pwcca
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06/10/08 04:59 PM
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Re: Following Biblical instructions
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Bex
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06/10/08 12:25 PM
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Re: Following Biblical instructions
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Laura Clement
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06/10/08 02:28 PM
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Re: Following Biblical instructions
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Kitsune
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06/10/08 03:49 PM
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Re: Following Biblical instructions
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Bex
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06/11/08 04:03 AM
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Re: Discovering the Conspirators
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LinearAq
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06/10/08 02:09 PM
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Re: Fundamentals
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LinearAq
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06/03/08 12:54 PM
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Encapsulated Complexity
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Russ
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06/06/08 12:45 AM
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Re: Encapsulated Complexity
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LinearAq
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06/06/08 01:14 PM
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Re: Encapsulated Complexity
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Kitsune
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06/06/08 01:33 PM
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Re: Most People Don't Want The Truth...
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CTD
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03/15/10 05:05 AM
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